Skip to content

Recent Comments

  1.  

    Vooch

    plenty of PBLs in City already see peak demand of 700-800/hour.

    And They have effective widths of 4′

  2.  

    reasonableexplanation

    Well, looking at google maps, the hudson river greenway is about as wide as a single vehicle lane of the WSH next to it. So physical width can’t be it in this case.

    https://goo.gl/maps/4yyhehopJqx

  3.  

    ahwr

    It compares something like six second bike throughput scaled up to an hour of uninterrupted flow to an assumed capacity of 600-800 cars per hour. Since bike throughput is assumed continuous and scaled up from an unsustainable peak flow rate, a comparable number for autos would be closer to 2500-3000 vehicles, maybe 4000-4500 people. Neither number is realistic.

    At 1000 bikes per hour on a ten foot lane cyclists would start screaming about the facility being overcapacity. Nevermind 7500. The NACTO figure is crap.

  4.  

    BBnet3000

    That’s another thing that gets me about VZ messaging though: the idea that it’s a pedestrian safety program only. Lots of people are injured and killed in automobiles in NYC too. Anyone using any form of transportation stands to be safer from street redesigns. In fact, the largest decline in injuries on many redesigned corridors has been among auto occupants.

    If Bill wants to change people’s personal habits he needs to get tougher on the bad habit of drinking and driving. The Swedes have reduced this really significantly and it’s a cornerstone of their roads becoming the safest in the world.

  5.  

    Vooch

    graphic compares equal roadway width

    plus graphic likeky does not account for the relative chaos of out greenway which is full of cinflicts and narrow spots.

  6.  

    com63

    BdB should do a citibike to 86th street express to City Hall commute. If he had real interest in Vision Zero, he would do this.

  7.  

    com63

    I know. Really bad messaging. He should really emphasize that the majority of New Yorkers are pedestrians first and that all of these things are trying to protect them from real dangers. Even people who drive most places in the city are often pedestrians too.

  8.  

    Simon Phearson

    “Deserve,” no. But if you regularly park your bike on the street, their complaints might strike you as a bit quaint.

  9.  

    BBnet3000

    I don’t care how often people get out of their cars so long as I can walk, ride and occasionally drive without being endangered or harassed.

    I really hate messaging that makes it sound like we are trying to control people’s daily habits and I suspect it’s fueling NIMBY resentment.

  10.  

    reasonableexplanation

    Yup, that seems to be more in line with what one would expect. Probably roughly matches the car volume increases too (people would be coming and going at roughly the same times, no matter the mode of transport)

  11.  

    kevd

    “The goal should be to get out of your car whenever possible” Unless, of course you’re the Mayor and you rsimply have to go to a gym 10 miles from your residence….

  12.  

    ahwr

    http://www.nyc.gov/html/dot/downloads/pdf/nycbicyclescrct.pdf

    2007-2010 18 hour midtown counts were average ~38% higher than 12 hour counts. 18 hour hudson greenway counts were average ~30% higher than 12 hour counts.

  13.  

    djx

    Whoa.

  14.  

    reasonableexplanation

    If you have the data I’d love to take a look.

    But either way, 12->18hour means a 50% time increase for a corresponding 64% volume increase? Outside the hours of 7am-7pm? I doubt it.

    Either way, the rough numbers are close enough to talk intelligently about the issue.

    Looking at the graphic you posted below that states that the capacity of a protected bikeway is 7500/hour… given that the hudson greenway (the most used bike path in all of north america, apparently) gets an average of only 460/hour between 7am-7pm…

    Makes it seem like either the graphic is off or that the greenway is severely under capacity.

  15.  

    Vooch

    solution to crowding on greenway is to reallocate one lane of West Side Highway for cyclists ( jersey barriers ) all the was from Battery to 57th street 24/7 from Memorial to Labor Day.

    the Bike path then becomes overflow for pedestrians, etc.

  16.  

    Brad Aaron

    “People who park for free on the street are fortunate to be able to do so, certainly, but I don’t think that means they deserve to have their plates stolen or anything.”

    Sure, but it’s another thing people who pay to park off-street (and people who don’t have cars) don’t have to deal with.

  17.  

    Vooch

    18 hour count was >8,500 in ’13 or ’14

    note the DOT counts do not include ‘commercial’ cyclists for some bizarre reason

  18.  

    JL

    This is a reply to Robert Wright’s post a couple of hours ago.

  19.  

    JL

    I don’t ride the GWay during rush on a regular basis, but I’ve been on it since its inception X years ago. I’ve witnessed a runner’s no look-U turn take out a cyclist, and had 2 close calls with runners myself. I came upon a bike on bike collision T-bone at 59th ~?5 yrs ago (back when there was high growth/ blind spot/ no traffic lights to ignore/ no guys standing around staring into space) when a women (northbound) on a Dahon tacoed her front wheel hitting two teenagers heading west and entering GW southbound. The women was on her back and in pain from jabbing the handlebar to her gut. A few passbyers called an ambulance and the young men stuck around. The EMT toke her to the hospital ‘against’ her wishes mumbling about insurance. I asked the EMT if they were going to take down info from the 2 teenagers. She (EMT) asked me if I was ‘with’ the cyclist, I said no, but I did ask the other 2 what happened. She then told me not to worry about it??? My point is that user behavior has gotten worst over the years where the GWay s***storm is the rule rather than the exception. I did meet the artist who sprayed “Stay Right Pass Left” white stencil a couple years back, he freshen it a couple of times before giving up. Even when there are no ‘security’ concerns, the GWay south of 96th st. is quickly becoming the victim of its own success. It’s incredibly efficient, but the perception is “anything goes” once your on it. Don’t get me started about guys with the ‘motorized’ bicycles.

  20.  

    reasonableexplanation

    See the numbers above; it’s about equivalent to taking away a half lane of the WSH.

  21.  

    reasonableexplanation

    Well, here’s the actual biking data:
    http://www.nyc.gov/html/dot/downloads/pdf/midtown-cycling-counts.pdf

    You’ll note the cycling counts for the Hudson river greenway in 2015 (pretty recent data) are at about 5500/ day. (down from last year, interestingly enough, maybe due to the expanding bike infrastructure elsewhere in the city).

    As for your motorist counting skills; literally; here’s the data, broken down by hour:
    http://ftp.dot.ny.gov/tdv/YR2013/R11/04_New%20York/04_1104_VOL_12-2013.pdf

    I’m sorry, but I trust this more than your personal experience.


    Now, to be fair, the bicycle counts are from 7am-7pm only, so taking the car data above and only counting 7am-7pm; you get 64000 cars total, or about 10500 per lane.

    I’d also like to point out that whatever arbitrary correction you’re applying to get increased bike traffic for the holiday weekend also applies to car traffic the same way, so for an apples to apples comparison, it’s likely a wash.

  22.  

    BBnet3000

    It’s so badly marked to begin with and in such an inappropriately narrow, high ped volume location that I only discovered the path was there after walking on it myself for quite awhile. Putting a path on Furman is really the only way around this.

    Also getting rid of the two blocks of rutty cobblestones with crumbling asphalt patching on York on the way there from the Manhattan Bridge would help as well.

  23.  

    Geck

    Totally lost opportunity on the “bike path” through Brooklyn Bridge Park. It is poorly marked, so pedestrians are all over it, while the frequent cobble stones speed bumps make it really jarring and unnerving (and the gravelly pavement, although the least of the problems, is less then ideal). I know they want to make sure bikes go slowly in the park, but they have made it so unpleasant that bicyclist just won’t use the park. Where is the all powerful bike lobby when we need it.

  24.  

    JoshNY

    Re. Free parking: the Crain’s letter to the editor is ridiculous (people who park their cars in garages pay those same registration fees the writer is complaining about, for one). The other one I don’t know. People who park for free on the street are fortunate to be able to do so, certainly, but I don’t think that means they deserve to have their plates stolen or anything.

  25.  

    BBnet3000

    Found via NYCBike on Reddit: If anyone knows someone who got their bike run over at Allen and Houston this morning (and is fortunately OK), someone got a pic of the truck: https://facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=10100317337564830&set=a.611690086060.2117124.5900010&type=3&theater

  26.  

    Jennifer

    I hate it when they do that! In the past I just took a lane of the West Side Highway. I would encourage others to do the same.

  27.  

    Clarence Eckerson Jr.

    Yup. Every other night there will be a reason to shut it down.

  28.  

    stairbob

    It’s quite simple. Large voting bloc = political power.

  29.  

    Doug G.

    Just wait until Barry Diller’s island in the Hudson opens and starts hosting events and concerts.

  30.  

    AlexWithAK

    Pretty soon after Joanna’s tweet, so would have been a stretch anyway, especially since it’s in the middle of a workday. But it should be noted for next month.

  31.  

    Joe Enoch

    This is a frightening precedent. Every time there is a car show/beer fest/hooligan convention at the piers there’s lots of foot traffic. Hopefully this doesn’t become standard operating procedure.

  32.  

    Robert Wright

    When my office was in midtown, I used to ride that section of the path twice daily on my way between 54th/55th St and the Brooklyn Bridge. The only serious injury I ever encountered there involved a runner who had stepped off the (admittedly narrow) pedestrian path in front of a cyclist who had crashed and broken his shoulder. I called an ambulance and waited with him. The runner was absolutely fine. I passed her later continuing her run as I rode home after putting him in the ambulance.

  33.  

    JudenChino

    Get those tweets ready or at least dial-in: https://twitter.com/BrianLehrer/status/736195337854046208

  34.  

    Joe R.

    It doesn’t make sense to me, either, for exactly that reason. Close off the greenway so pedestrians don’t get hit by bikes but keep the West Side Highway open so they can still get hit by cars???? No logic in that whatsoever. Unfortunately, it seems many of those in charge still don’t “get it” that bicycles aren’t just something you take to a park on a warm Sunday to tool around. They’re a serious, viable form of transportation in this city at this point. They should be treated as such. If the West Side Highway must remain open for transportation reasons, then so should the greenway.

  35.  

    Guest

    When the cathedrals were white…

  36.  

    KeNYC2030

    It would be a huge public service if someone could investigate the black hole where these anti-cyclist decisions are made and demand accountability.

  37.  

    Guest

    No. The grades don’t work. Never mind the differences in car design necessary to fit through PATH tunnels or the reliability issues of extending the length of the 6 train run so much further…

  38.  

    JL

    I’m guessing they are protecting the perimeter of the “Secured” area and the 3 or 4 choke points where sailors funnel to/from the piers. A bicycle with the right gearing could be a pretty good low tech delivery system. It’s mostly just for show like the TSA. With a city full of soft targets, Times Square at evening rush hour remains the softest high value target of all. I know this because I have friends on the counter… So don’t put me on some watch list, besides the one for being a cyclist:-) joking, really!

  39.  

    BBnet3000

    Riding a bike on the Brooklyn Bridge Park “bike path” is like riding a bike through a shopping mall on Black Friday (except a shopping mall floor doesn’t have cobblestones every 30 feet).

    They ought to put a real, properly marked bike path on Furman St if they’re serious about this Waterfront Greenway thing.

  40.  

    Doug G.

    I honestly don’t understand why they can’t just put up some temporary barriers and shift the bike lane over to the roadway for about 10 blocks to keep this open for people on bikes. It’s all so binary. “It’s crowded so we have to shut it down!” No! There are other options! Really shows how little people understand bikes as transportation.

  41.  

    MtotheI

    I don’t understand what the safety issue could be with bicycles at this location? When was the last time someone was killed or seriously injured by a bicycle there? If there are so many pedestrians due to the holiday and fleet week, they should close down the West Side Highway so pedestrians don’t get run over or hit by cars. Why target cyclists?

  42.  

    Vooch

    DOT counts from 2012 show Greenway at 8,500. 2016 counts are easily over 9,000.

    Might be even 12,000 cyclists over the holiday weekend

    Holiday motor traffic is the metric here – 6,000 motors in right lane is a solid estlmate for this Friday, Sat, Sun, & Monday.

  43.  

    Geck

    Quiet a contrast to the Adams Street approach to the Brooklyn Bridge where they have gone out of their way to preserve a bike facility through the construction zone. Thanks to DDC and their contractors.

  44.  

    reasonableexplanation

    Vooch, are you pulling these numbers out of thin air? Where did you get the 9000 cyclists number? Did you make it up?

    FYI, the west side highway has about 100,000 cars per day at that spot. (You can find the data yourself at http://gis3.dot.ny.gov/html5viewer/?viewer=tdv the most recent data is for 12/3-12/5 2013)

    That gives you a bit under 17,000 per lane on a regular day.

  45.  

    Vooch

    Citibike will see 50,000 days become routine this summer. Next year, Citibike will see 60,000 become the norm. Citibikes plus private bike trips are then likely to exceed 600,000.

    Swarms of cyclists will be owning lanes everywhere in 12 months. The cranks will be hysterical. It will be important for advocates to start framing the argument why PBLs are the solution.

    A modest goal would be for the city leadership to commit to 25 miles of new PBLs annually. “5 miles in each boro for 5 years”

  46.  

    bolwerk

    Is that idea even technically feasible?

  47.  

    Vooch

    bike lanes carry 7x the traffic of car lanes. The Hudson Greenway is most heavily traveled bike path in North America.

    see attached: https://uploads.disquscdn.com/images/54eb171224b6bf3a3135f06cd35cdb3aff31a0c5d8f8da43efefce6ce502ca4b.jpg

  48.  

    com63

    So taking away the two lanes of bike traffic is like closing 1.5-2 vehicle lanes of the WSH.

  49.  

    Vooch

    per lane ?

    likely about 6,000

  50.  

    com63

    Do you know what the equivalent car trip count per lane is on the West Side Highway in this section?