Comments on: To Reduce Pedestrian Fatalities, Focus Enforcement on Cars http://www.streetsblog.org/2009/06/05/to-reduce-pedestrian-fatalities-focus-enforcement-on-cars/ Covering the New York City Streets Renaissance Mon, 23 Nov 2009 00:01:47 -0500 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.8 hourly 1 By: Jonathan http://www.streetsblog.org/2009/06/05/to-reduce-pedestrian-fatalities-focus-enforcement-on-cars/comment-page-1/#comment-69378 Jonathan Fri, 05 Jun 2009 20:24:06 +0000 http://www.streetsblog.org/?p=6330#comment-69378 I peeped at the S'blog Network post on the Tempe, AZ transportation center. It looks really amazing, even to my jaded eyes. http://www.tempe.gov/greenprograms/transitcenter.htm Imagine if Port Authority was built next door to a football stadium and basketball arena, and had a bike storage station, a carshare garage, <i>and</i> hiking trailheads up a nearby mountain. Now I want to visit. I peeped at the S'blog Network post on the Tempe, AZ transportation center. It looks really amazing, even to my jaded eyes.

http://www.tempe.gov/greenprograms/transitcenter.htm

Imagine if Port Authority was built next door to a football stadium and basketball arena, and had a bike storage station, a carshare garage, and hiking trailheads up a nearby mountain. Now I want to visit.

]]> By: James http://www.streetsblog.org/2009/06/05/to-reduce-pedestrian-fatalities-focus-enforcement-on-cars/comment-page-1/#comment-69373 James Fri, 05 Jun 2009 19:23:13 +0000 http://www.streetsblog.org/?p=6330#comment-69373 Kaja, do you really observe a substantial difference in motorist behavior between New York and New Jersey? As a transplant, I personally can't distinguish between different vehicle "dialects" in the Tri-State Area, although I have noticed that the driving style tends to mellow out along the fringes of the metro area. Kaja, do you really observe a substantial difference in motorist behavior between New York and New Jersey? As a transplant, I personally can't distinguish between different vehicle "dialects" in the Tri-State Area, although I have noticed that the driving style tends to mellow out along the fringes of the metro area.

]]> By: Kaja http://www.streetsblog.org/2009/06/05/to-reduce-pedestrian-fatalities-focus-enforcement-on-cars/comment-page-1/#comment-69372 Kaja Fri, 05 Jun 2009 18:55:46 +0000 http://www.streetsblog.org/?p=6330#comment-69372 One of the primary characteristics of Jersey driving, walking, biking, and /being/ is the attitude whereby "when in Rome, act like I'm in Bergen." Laws & customs in New York are very different from Jersey's, regarding pedestrian presence in intersections, driver behavior in crowded roads, following distance, lane order & change behavior, and yields. When I'm in Jersey I try to drive a bit more like folks there do. When they're here, they seem to act like they're right at home. One of the primary characteristics of Jersey driving, walking, biking, and /being/ is the attitude whereby "when in Rome, act like I'm in Bergen." Laws & customs in New York are very different from Jersey's, regarding pedestrian presence in intersections, driver behavior in crowded roads, following distance, lane order & change behavior, and yields.

When I'm in Jersey I try to drive a bit more like folks there do. When they're here, they seem to act like they're right at home.

]]> By: Benjamin Running http://www.streetsblog.org/2009/06/05/to-reduce-pedestrian-fatalities-focus-enforcement-on-cars/comment-page-1/#comment-69369 Benjamin Running Fri, 05 Jun 2009 18:31:33 +0000 http://www.streetsblog.org/?p=6330#comment-69369 I'd like to see more enforcement at stop signs. Drivers are, of course, suppose to stop at stop signs, then slowly proceed into the intersection if they can't tell if it's clear to proceed (on small streets with parking right to the corners, it's often hard to tell if there's traffic on the street you are crossing). In the Williamsburg/Greenpoint area, I so rarely see drivers actually stop at the signs, they almost always just slow down, rolling through the stop sign and into the intersection I'd like to see more enforcement at stop signs.

Drivers are, of course, suppose to stop at stop signs, then slowly proceed into the intersection if they can't tell if it's clear to proceed (on small streets with parking right to the corners, it's often hard to tell if there's traffic on the street you are crossing).

In the Williamsburg/Greenpoint area, I so rarely see drivers actually stop at the signs, they almost always just slow down, rolling through the stop sign and into the intersection

]]> By: Ian Turner http://www.streetsblog.org/2009/06/05/to-reduce-pedestrian-fatalities-focus-enforcement-on-cars/comment-page-1/#comment-69365 Ian Turner Fri, 05 Jun 2009 17:20:31 +0000 http://www.streetsblog.org/?p=6330#comment-69365 Andy, at least in New York that's not considered jaywalking and not illegal; pedestrians are only required to "yield" to automobiles when crossing mid-block. Crossing against traffic signals is a different question, however. Andy, at least in New York that's not considered jaywalking and not illegal; pedestrians are only required to "yield" to automobiles when crossing mid-block. Crossing against traffic signals is a different question, however.

]]> By: Andy B from Jersey http://www.streetsblog.org/2009/06/05/to-reduce-pedestrian-fatalities-focus-enforcement-on-cars/comment-page-1/#comment-69363 Andy B from Jersey Fri, 05 Jun 2009 17:13:39 +0000 http://www.streetsblog.org/?p=6330#comment-69363 I should add however, if a pedestrian crosses mid-block and is very careful to look both ways before walking into the street, then I believe that the police ARE NOT justified to give out a jaywalking ticket. I should add however, if a pedestrian crosses mid-block and is very careful to look both ways before walking into the street, then I believe that the police ARE NOT justified to give out a jaywalking ticket.

]]> By: Andy B from Jersey http://www.streetsblog.org/2009/06/05/to-reduce-pedestrian-fatalities-focus-enforcement-on-cars/comment-page-1/#comment-69362 Andy B from Jersey Fri, 05 Jun 2009 17:10:15 +0000 http://www.streetsblog.org/?p=6330#comment-69362 Okay, I found the original story about the pedestrian killed in Savanna. (http://savannahnow.com/node/711656). The guy was in the crosswalk and as far as I know, crossing legally (he was an older Swedish gentleman so I doubt he was jaywalking)! Talk about totally misdirected police action. However, I'm not against police ticketing jaywalkers who are a blatant danger to themselves and to others. If your an adult and walk out into traffic without looking or against the light with traffic coming, you deserve a ticket. Unfortunately, I see way to many pedestrians in New Jersey acting just this way. I had a group of people do that today as I was riding to work and I needed to take evasive action to avoid plowing into them with my bike. Okay, I found the original story about the pedestrian killed in Savanna. (http://savannahnow.com/node/711656). The guy was in the crosswalk and as far as I know, crossing legally (he was an older Swedish gentleman so I doubt he was jaywalking)! Talk about totally misdirected police action.

However, I'm not against police ticketing jaywalkers who are a blatant danger to themselves and to others. If your an adult and walk out into traffic without looking or against the light with traffic coming, you deserve a ticket. Unfortunately, I see way to many pedestrians in New Jersey acting just this way.

I had a group of people do that today as I was riding to work and I needed to take evasive action to avoid plowing into them with my bike.

]]> By: Ian Turner http://www.streetsblog.org/2009/06/05/to-reduce-pedestrian-fatalities-focus-enforcement-on-cars/comment-page-1/#comment-69355 Ian Turner Fri, 05 Jun 2009 16:09:18 +0000 http://www.streetsblog.org/?p=6330#comment-69355 I believe the existing law is already adequate here. Pedestrians have the right of way for as long as it takes to cross the street, provided they started crossing during a "walk" phase. <a HREF="http://public.leginfo.state.ny.us/LAWSSEAF.cgi?QUERYTYPE=LAWS+&QUERYDATA=$$VAT1112$$@TXVAT01112+&LIST=LAW+&BROWSER=26755002+&TOKEN=19262168+&TARGET=VIEW" rel="nofollow">NYC VAT § 1112</A>. I believe the existing law is already adequate here. Pedestrians have the right of way for as long as it takes to cross the street, provided they started crossing during a "walk" phase. NYC VAT § 1112.

]]> By: mike http://www.streetsblog.org/2009/06/05/to-reduce-pedestrian-fatalities-focus-enforcement-on-cars/comment-page-1/#comment-69354 mike Fri, 05 Jun 2009 16:06:57 +0000 http://www.streetsblog.org/?p=6330#comment-69354 What is it supposed to mean when the person quoted claims that Savannah is the "number one walking city in the nation"? What is it supposed to mean when the person quoted claims that Savannah is the "number one walking city in the nation"?

]]> By: Kaja http://www.streetsblog.org/2009/06/05/to-reduce-pedestrian-fatalities-focus-enforcement-on-cars/comment-page-1/#comment-69352 Kaja Fri, 05 Jun 2009 15:17:19 +0000 http://www.streetsblog.org/?p=6330#comment-69352 By the way, IANAL, but I believe accelerating into a crosswalk full of people is already illegal; the law prohibits a collision with a pedestrian that was avoidable with an exercise of due care on part of the driver is illegal. Anyone who plows through a newly-greenlit crosswalk with their five thousand pound car and hits folks, or just rolls into a green without looking, is committing a crime already. We don't need yet another law. We need cops and prosecutors who'll do their goddamned jobs. By the way, IANAL, but I believe accelerating into a crosswalk full of people is already illegal; the law prohibits a collision with a pedestrian that was avoidable with an exercise of due care on part of the driver is illegal.

Anyone who plows through a newly-greenlit crosswalk with their five thousand pound car and hits folks, or just rolls into a green without looking, is committing a crime already. We don't need yet another law.

We need cops and prosecutors who'll do their goddamned jobs.

]]> By: ChipSeal http://www.streetsblog.org/2009/06/05/to-reduce-pedestrian-fatalities-focus-enforcement-on-cars/comment-page-1/#comment-69351 ChipSeal Fri, 05 Jun 2009 15:17:12 +0000 http://www.streetsblog.org/?p=6330#comment-69351 Operators of automobiles are way too cavalier about the potential harm their actions can do. It is a crime when someone drives a vehicle in willful or wanton disregard for the safety of persons or property. It is evil behavior. It is time to stop making excuses and man up to the problem: Driving is so commonplace that we have stopped acting with due care. Operators of automobiles are way too cavalier about the potential harm their actions can do. It is a crime when someone drives a vehicle in willful or wanton disregard for the safety of persons or property. It is evil behavior.

It is time to stop making excuses and man up to the problem: Driving is so commonplace that we have stopped acting with due care.

]]> By: Kaja http://www.streetsblog.org/2009/06/05/to-reduce-pedestrian-fatalities-focus-enforcement-on-cars/comment-page-1/#comment-69350 Kaja Fri, 05 Jun 2009 15:14:39 +0000 http://www.streetsblog.org/?p=6330#comment-69350 Ticketing jaywalkers is absurd. Walking against the light is, itself, voiding your right of way to the cars; so if they hit you, it's your fault. Why _additional_ penalties? All a ticket's going to do is raise revenue, legitimize authority, and piss off thousands of reasonable people. It certainly won't stop jaywalking. Longer light timings and thinner streets are the answer, but that won't help the government raise revenue, or get more cops hired. Ticketing jaywalkers is absurd. Walking against the light is, itself, voiding your right of way to the cars; so if they hit you, it's your fault.

Why _additional_ penalties? All a ticket's going to do is raise revenue, legitimize authority, and piss off thousands of reasonable people. It certainly won't stop jaywalking.

Longer light timings and thinner streets are the answer, but that won't help the government raise revenue, or get more cops hired.

]]> By: Greg Raisman http://www.streetsblog.org/2009/06/05/to-reduce-pedestrian-fatalities-focus-enforcement-on-cars/comment-page-1/#comment-69345 Greg Raisman Fri, 05 Jun 2009 14:35:21 +0000 http://www.streetsblog.org/?p=6330#comment-69345 Oregon has a very good pedestrian safety law called "Stop and Stay Stopped". The law passed in 2003. There has been a LOT of other work done in coordination with it to educate the public about how it works. I believe it contributed to that fact that 2008 saw the lowest number of pedestrian fatalities in Portland's history, with a record that dates to 1925. Here's some info: New animation about the law: http://www.portlandonline.com/mayor/index.cfm?c=49521&a=248292 Streetfilm about crosswalk safety missions: http://www.streetfilms.org/archives/portland-or-crosswalk-enforcement-actions/ Oregon ped laws - read 811.028 first: http://www.portlandonline.com/transportation/index.cfm?c=37504&a=70893 Pedestrian safety efforts: http://www.portlandonline.com/transportation/index.cfm?c=40554 Portland fatal trends: ftp://ftp.trans.ci.portland.or.us/raisman/Fatal%20Trends/Fatal%20Overview%20April%2016%202009.pdf Thanks. Greg Raisman Community and School Traffic Safety Partnership Portland Bureau of Transportation Oregon has a very good pedestrian safety law called "Stop and Stay Stopped". The law passed in 2003. There has been a LOT of other work done in coordination with it to educate the public about how it works. I believe it contributed to that fact that 2008 saw the lowest number of pedestrian fatalities in Portland's history, with a record that dates to 1925.

Here's some info:

New animation about the law: http://www.portlandonline.com/mayor/index.cfm?c=49521&a=248292

Streetfilm about crosswalk safety missions: http://www.streetfilms.org/archives/portland-or-crosswalk-enforcement-actions/

Oregon ped laws - read 811.028 first: http://www.portlandonline.com/transportation/index.cfm?c=37504&a=70893

Pedestrian safety efforts: http://www.portlandonline.com/transportation/index.cfm?c=40554

Portland fatal trends: ftp://ftp.trans.ci.portland.or.us/raisman/Fatal%20Trends/Fatal%20Overview%20April%2016%202009.pdf

Thanks.
Greg Raisman
Community and School Traffic Safety Partnership
Portland Bureau of Transportation

]]>