Comments on: Hudson Greenway “Cherry Walk” Still Dark and Dangerous

By: John Deere

John Deere — Wed, 03 Dec 2008 18:37:39 +0000

I ride this section every night on my way home, and have done so for the past 4 years. Each year I've complained to DOT about burned out street lights. I've also asked Parks to install better striping around the edge. Having tired of waiting for DOT to fix the burned out lamps over the highway (which does make a difference), and for parks to install some real striping, I fixed the problem (at least for myself) by pouring some money on it, in the form of 2 separate 200 lumen lighting systems, costing about $120 each. Problem solved. I now have enough lighting to light up the path well ahead of me, and cut through the glare of on-coming headlights. Modestly priced LEDs and Halogens don't cut it in this section. Also, it helps a lot to slow down, and not outrun your vision.

My lights? Cygolite Rover II LED on the handlebar, and Dinotte helmet mount light.

By: Ken Campbell

Ken Campbell — Mon, 01 Dec 2008 17:56:32 +0000

I have ridden this stretch and faced the glare of oncoming headlights in the dark of autumn evenings. I upgraded my bike lights and made it possible to see the route but never felt fully safe - I took it slower and still had close calls with oncoming bikers. I have to agree that there is no good solution short of a ground lighing system.

By: Bernard Marx

Bernard Marx — Mon, 01 Dec 2008 17:39:48 +0000

I hate to say this, but I don't think this is a solvable problem. If you're riding northbound, you face directly into multiple headlights, from multiple angles, all of which are aimed to their right. [Vehicle headlights are supposed to illuminate the right side of the road more brightly than the left in order to avoid blinding oncoming traffic and in order to make signs (which are usually on the right side) easier to see.] Even with better street-lighting (which isn't going to happen for a variety of practical reasons), cyclists would still be blinded by the on-coming headlights, which is the real problem here. Potentially, hedges or something similar could be planted, but this would obstruct the view of the river from cars (I know, boo hoo), and would almost certainly be strongly opposed. I don't think there's a practical alternative to exiting the path at 96th street after dark.

By: BrooklynBus

BrooklynBus — Mon, 01 Dec 2008 17:12:43 +0000

Another reason why a half dozen DOT top officials who are all making over $100,000 a year did not deserve the raises Bloomberg gave them a few weeks ago, two days before he ordered job freezes.

DOT claims that safety is their top priority. What a joke!

By: Andy B from Jersey

Andy B from Jersey — Sat, 29 Nov 2008 05:31:53 +0000

Mike,

Agreed. I have a half dozen or so lights, from modest LED and halogen headlights (I don't use the halogen anymore, better as a flashlight) to a super high powered Nightrider HID system that has a beam pattern best suited for technical trail riding (throws light all over the place). Believe it or not I rarely use the HID light anymore even though I spent $400 on it (almost a shame really). I'll have to check out those German lights the next time I visit family back in Bavaria. They sound really neat!

No mater the headlight however I always use a fairly basic rear blinky LED but I do have a Planet Bike Super Flash which is really awesome but more prone to theft.

Anyway, I had a thought after reading the suggested of bushes along the highway. I doubt either the NYC Parks or DoT would go for an impenetrable hedgerow but what about some fat bush every 20 or 30 feet. At an acute angle to the line of the road, the bushes would overlap blocking the glare of the headlights without walling off the Cherry Walk from the road. Also some of those paddle shaped glare blockers that are positioned perpendicular to the road and use the same acute angle concept could be mounted to the guardrail.

By: nyctaxiphoto

nyctaxiphoto — Sat, 29 Nov 2008 03:16:48 +0000

it isn't just coincidence that more accidents occur where there is inadequate lighting. also it's dangerous on so many levels.

By: Michael Steiner

Michael Steiner — Fri, 28 Nov 2008 23:18:33 +0000

Urbanis (#13), i did not say that right now a good light is sufficient for the cherry walk. However, the current problem is the more glare and less the lack of (any) street lighting. A bicycle should be equipped with a light which allows not only to be seen but also to see. But i guess having grown up in a rural area this is somewhat (too) self-evident, certainly judging from the average NY cyclist where you have to be glad if they have any lights at night ...

By: Ken

Ken — Fri, 28 Nov 2008 20:41:58 +0000

I just rode this stretch last night, heading south. Despite a blinky and a moderately priced headlight, I ran off the path once and almost into a tree.

By: Urbanis

Urbanis — Fri, 28 Nov 2008 17:49:25 +0000

Re: #12, I disagree. I have always ridden the Cherry Walk at night with lights running on my bike, and they are not powerful enough to illuminate all the hidden hazards of the path.

By: Michael Steiner

Michael Steiner — Thu, 27 Nov 2008 16:44:34 +0000

Ignoring crime-aspects of road lighting, i don't think the cherry walk needs lights but cyclist should equip their bikes with proper lights (it's not only the law but also an important safety aspect, not only for you but also for your fellow road users).

However, i completely agree that the glare from Henry Hudson is painful riding north, no matter how good your lights. Putting up hedges & trees might have the additional benefit of noise reduction (and, if tall enough, might even reduce speeding, at least if what Tom Vanderbilt in Traffic regarding sound barriers on page 116 is true

By: mike

mike — Thu, 27 Nov 2008 14:10:24 +0000

Andy B - perhaps we'll have to grow up as a bike riding nation and start looking at bikes as vehicles and develop some standards similar to the Germans when it comes to lighting ... I have several German lights - both dyno and battery powered - they typically use optics which shape the beam much like a car headlight and throw the light on the road where you need it... even a 3w E6 light can put out enough light to ride unlit dark country roads... and with the new LEDs that are dyno powered there are even more options for light just where you want it.

By: Andy B from Jersey

Andy B from Jersey — Thu, 27 Nov 2008 05:42:10 +0000

Plus imagine if you used a high powered LED or HID headlight that would allow you to see the path while facing oncoming traffic.

I freak out drivers all the time when I ride with mine while on the street going WITH traffic. Facing the oncoming cars while on the path you with such a light you are sure to freak out drivers coming towards you, since they are libel to think that there is an oncoming car or motorcycle head straight towards them!!

While a bidirectional sidepath is an appropriate treatment at this location I do have concerns when they are used in surface street applications in suburban settings for the exactly the problem I point out above. Never mind the other issues of bicycle / motor vehicle conflicts at intersections and driveways.

By: mike

mike — Thu, 27 Nov 2008 03:37:32 +0000

i'll admit to never having ridden this stretch... but all the MUPs here in burlington, vt are unlit (except @ street crossings)... and while we don't have trees and planters and landscaping down the center of them... we do have crap pavement, manhole covers, curves, trash, downed branches, and trees and roots to either side.

wouldn't some proper bike lights help tremendously?

By: Fendergal

Fendergal — Thu, 27 Nov 2008 00:52:00 +0000

This is why I always exit the greenway at 96th and finish my commute home on Riverside Drive. Even if there were lights on the greenway, the glare of the oncoming cars' headlights would continue to blind anybody riding northbound. The curviness of the Cherry Walk might be pleasant in the daylight, but at night, it is a recipe for disaster, especially given those trees in the middle.

By: Stacy

Stacy — Wed, 26 Nov 2008 23:55:14 +0000

I just got back from riding Cherry Walk, southbound, in the dark, and was amazed by how well my new 5 led Grog blinkie was able to light up those driveway reflectors near the islands. If DOT installed some of that industrial grade reflective material onto the guard rails it could make a real difference.

By: AaronJ

AaronJ — Wed, 26 Nov 2008 20:32:52 +0000

I rode this once at night and will never do it again. One low-cost stopgap would be to paint the green line around both sides of the two "islands" in the greenway with the trees on them. This suggestion was made in the letters column of the old TA magazine a few years ago.

By: J

Wed, 26 Nov 2008 20:31:58 +0000

The really dark stretches are the same ones that have stretches of burned-out highway lights. If NYSDOT or NYCDOT simply replaced the burned out lights on the highway, it would do a lot to fix this problem.

By: Michael Konrad

Michael Konrad — Wed, 26 Nov 2008 19:33:52 +0000

I do not ride the greenway at night for this very reason -- it's way too easy to accidentally ride right off the pavement and lose control. The street is much safer.

By: Urbanis

Urbanis — Wed, 26 Nov 2008 19:19:43 +0000

At the very least, some low-cost solutions not requiring electric lines could be implemented immediately:

(1) reflective paint defining the lane boundaries
(2) reflective posts (as one sees on highways)

I also agree with Stacy that hedges between the path and the automobile roadway would block out the blinding headlights.

Ultimately, of course, proper lighting would solve the problem.

The same problem exists further north on the Greenway near the GWB between roughly 162nd and 165th streets.

By: Lars Klove

Lars Klove — Wed, 26 Nov 2008 19:10:34 +0000

It seems some brilliant person placed driveway reflectors on the 2 "islands" on this stretch. They are slowly disappearing.

They don't show very well anyway. Maybe some pink flamingos would work better, or a santa with reindeer.