Comments on: T.A. Offers Reward for Park Slope “Post-Automobile Street” Designs http://www.streetsblog.org/2008/07/07/reward-offered-for-best-post-automobile-street-designs/ Covering the New York City Streets Renaissance Mon, 22 Mar 2010 06:49:33 -0500 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.8 hourly 1 By: Joe http://www.streetsblog.org/2008/07/07/reward-offered-for-best-post-automobile-street-designs/comment-page-1/#comment-53219 Joe Wed, 09 Jul 2008 01:10:10 +0000 http://www.streetsblog.org/2008/07/07/reward-offered-for-best-post-automobile-street-designs/#comment-53219 @Paul: Those Amsterdam street scenes look great, but keep in mind that the subway already runs both under (R train) and above (F train) 4th Ave/9th St., so you would not need to dedicate any above-ground area for additional trams/streetcars/etc. @Paul: Those Amsterdam street scenes look great, but keep in mind that the subway already runs both under (R train) and above (F train) 4th Ave/9th St., so you would not need to dedicate any above-ground area for additional trams/streetcars/etc.

]]> By: JP http://www.streetsblog.org/2008/07/07/reward-offered-for-best-post-automobile-street-designs/comment-page-1/#comment-53153 JP Mon, 07 Jul 2008 19:06:29 +0000 http://www.streetsblog.org/2008/07/07/reward-offered-for-best-post-automobile-street-designs/#comment-53153 The real challenge will be addressing the truck traffic. A realistic redesign of the intersection will need to accept the fact that 4th Ave is a truck route. Perhaps all truck traffic could be diverted to 3rd, but I don't know how easy it is to change a street's designation so that it is no longer a truck route. Also, the medians on 4th ave have vents for the subway underneath, so landscaping the medians will be a problem. The real challenge will be addressing the truck traffic. A realistic redesign of the intersection will need to accept the fact that 4th Ave is a truck route. Perhaps all truck traffic could be diverted to 3rd, but I don't know how easy it is to change a street's designation so that it is no longer a truck route. Also, the medians on 4th ave have vents for the subway underneath, so landscaping the medians will be a problem.

]]> By: Larry Littlefield http://www.streetsblog.org/2008/07/07/reward-offered-for-best-post-automobile-street-designs/comment-page-1/#comment-53151 Larry Littlefield Mon, 07 Jul 2008 18:59:20 +0000 http://www.streetsblog.org/2008/07/07/reward-offered-for-best-post-automobile-street-designs/#comment-53151 What an amazing decison urbanis. Those pictures say it all. All the more reason to make Park a bicycle boulevard, with strategically-placed interruptions for motor vehicles to discourage through traffic. Make it more like it was. I'm not sure 4th Avenue in Brooklyn is a place for that, however. There aren't a bunch of other wide avenues right next to it. What an amazing decison urbanis. Those pictures say it all.

All the more reason to make Park a bicycle boulevard, with strategically-placed interruptions for motor vehicles to discourage through traffic. Make it more like it was.

I'm not sure 4th Avenue in Brooklyn is a place for that, however. There aren't a bunch of other wide avenues right next to it.

]]> By: Bob http://www.streetsblog.org/2008/07/07/reward-offered-for-best-post-automobile-street-designs/comment-page-1/#comment-53150 Bob Mon, 07 Jul 2008 18:58:47 +0000 http://www.streetsblog.org/2008/07/07/reward-offered-for-best-post-automobile-street-designs/#comment-53150 Larry - you could probably still have a roundabout, with 2-lane entrances, flaring out by taking the parking lanes at the entrances. I think it's an idea worth pushing. Larry - you could probably still have a roundabout, with 2-lane entrances, flaring out by taking the parking lanes at the entrances. I think it's an idea worth pushing.

]]> By: Spud Spudly http://www.streetsblog.org/2008/07/07/reward-offered-for-best-post-automobile-street-designs/comment-page-1/#comment-53148 Spud Spudly Mon, 07 Jul 2008 18:55:55 +0000 http://www.streetsblog.org/2008/07/07/reward-offered-for-best-post-automobile-street-designs/#comment-53148 Holy moly, I never knew that about Park Avenue! That's amazing. Holy moly, I never knew that about Park Avenue! That's amazing.

]]> By: Urbanis http://www.streetsblog.org/2008/07/07/reward-offered-for-best-post-automobile-street-designs/comment-page-1/#comment-53147 Urbanis Mon, 07 Jul 2008 18:51:21 +0000 http://www.streetsblog.org/2008/07/07/reward-offered-for-best-post-automobile-street-designs/#comment-53147 Larry, I have an idea: see the pre-1922 photograph of Park Avenue at http://www.naparstek.com/2005/12/history-of-new-york-city-public-space.php Larry, I have an idea: see the pre-1922 photograph of Park Avenue at http://www.naparstek.com/2005/12/history-of-new-york-city-public-space.php

]]> By: Larry Littlefield http://www.streetsblog.org/2008/07/07/reward-offered-for-best-post-automobile-street-designs/comment-page-1/#comment-53146 Larry Littlefield Mon, 07 Jul 2008 18:40:31 +0000 http://www.streetsblog.org/2008/07/07/reward-offered-for-best-post-automobile-street-designs/#comment-53146 Given that 9th Street and 4th Avenue were built this wide in a pre-automobile world, I'm not sure one could really make 4th Ave one lane in each direction. If you could, I suppose a small traffic circle could be installed. I guess one could say that absent automobiles one could eliminate the parking lanes, but that seems a long way off. Given that 9th Street and 4th Avenue were built this wide in a pre-automobile world, I'm not sure one could really make 4th Ave one lane in each direction. If you could, I suppose a small traffic circle could be installed.

I guess one could say that absent automobiles one could eliminate the parking lanes, but that seems a long way off.

]]> By: Paul http://www.streetsblog.org/2008/07/07/reward-offered-for-best-post-automobile-street-designs/comment-page-1/#comment-53140 Paul Mon, 07 Jul 2008 18:12:14 +0000 http://www.streetsblog.org/2008/07/07/reward-offered-for-best-post-automobile-street-designs/#comment-53140 Ok, I had this really great idea. Then I realized it's already been done thousands of times in other countries. Damn! Idea #1 http://www.envoguemusic.com/images/turkey/DamrakTram2.jpg And since 9th Ave is wide enough, you may allow cars too: http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/7/7b/Tram24Amsterdam2.jpg Cars, peds, bikes and trams all on the same street and with little interference from each other? Who would've thought? Wake up America? The near perfect model lies just across the Atlantic. It's simple. Just do it before I leave this shithole. Ok, I had this really great idea. Then I realized it's already been done thousands of times in other countries. Damn!

Idea #1 http://www.envoguemusic.com/images/turkey/DamrakTram2.jpg

And since 9th Ave is wide enough, you may allow cars too:
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/7/7b/Tram24Amsterdam2.jpg

Cars, peds, bikes and trams all on the same street and with little interference from each other? Who would've thought? Wake up America? The near perfect model lies just across the Atlantic. It's simple. Just do it before I leave this shithole.

]]> By: Tom Rorb http://www.streetsblog.org/2008/07/07/reward-offered-for-best-post-automobile-street-designs/comment-page-1/#comment-53137 Tom Rorb Mon, 07 Jul 2008 18:06:51 +0000 http://www.streetsblog.org/2008/07/07/reward-offered-for-best-post-automobile-street-designs/#comment-53137 This is an amazing idea. If it works and can find more sponsors and $$$, you could have a yearly contest at one of the worst intersections in each of the five boros. This is an amazing idea. If it works and can find more sponsors and $$$, you could have a yearly contest at one of the worst intersections in each of the five boros.

]]> By: paul http://www.streetsblog.org/2008/07/07/reward-offered-for-best-post-automobile-street-designs/comment-page-1/#comment-53135 paul Mon, 07 Jul 2008 18:00:27 +0000 http://www.streetsblog.org/2008/07/07/reward-offered-for-best-post-automobile-street-designs/#comment-53135 Thanks for the mention, StreetsBlog! in total, the prize money amounts to $12,000. $6k for 1st, then $4k and $2k for second and third respectively. first prize may also get a dinner with Jan Gehl. Third prize gets a burrito with Noah Budnick. Thanks for the mention, StreetsBlog! in total, the prize money amounts to $12,000. $6k for 1st, then $4k and $2k for second and third respectively. first prize may also get a dinner with Jan Gehl. Third prize gets a burrito with Noah Budnick.

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