Comments on: Queens CBs Greet Vernon Boulevard Bike Lanes With Skepticism http://www.streetsblog.org/2008/07/07/queens-cbs-greet-vernon-boulevard-bike-lanes-with-skepticism/ Covering the New York City Streets Renaissance Mon, 23 Nov 2009 04:32:54 -0500 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.8 hourly 1 By: mfs http://www.streetsblog.org/2008/07/07/queens-cbs-greet-vernon-boulevard-bike-lanes-with-skepticism/comment-page-1/#comment-53199 mfs Tue, 08 Jul 2008 18:53:05 +0000 http://www.streetsblog.org/2008/07/07/queens-cbs-greet-vernon-boulevard-bike-lanes-with-skepticism/#comment-53199 QC- 38% of folks working in the area next to the bike path commute by foot, bike or mass transit. 48% by single-occupant vehicle. This is about even for Queens as a whole. Source: Census Transportation Planning Package Queens County Tracts: 0025 0035 0037 0039 0041 0081 0083 0087 http://www.uwm.edu/Dept/ETI/drilldowns/index.html QC-
38% of folks working in the area next to the bike path commute by foot, bike or mass transit. 48% by single-occupant vehicle. This is about even for Queens as a whole.

Source: Census Transportation Planning Package
Queens County
Tracts: 0025 0035 0037 0039 0041 0081 0083 0087
http://www.uwm.edu/Dept/ETI/drilldowns/index.html

]]> By: Glenn http://www.streetsblog.org/2008/07/07/queens-cbs-greet-vernon-boulevard-bike-lanes-with-skepticism/comment-page-1/#comment-53167 Glenn Tue, 08 Jul 2008 11:49:11 +0000 http://www.streetsblog.org/2008/07/07/queens-cbs-greet-vernon-boulevard-bike-lanes-with-skepticism/#comment-53167 Glad to hear it Eric! Glad to hear it Eric!

]]> By: Roosevelt Island 360 (Eric) http://www.streetsblog.org/2008/07/07/queens-cbs-greet-vernon-boulevard-bike-lanes-with-skepticism/comment-page-1/#comment-53166 Roosevelt Island 360 (Eric) Tue, 08 Jul 2008 04:02:26 +0000 http://www.streetsblog.org/2008/07/07/queens-cbs-greet-vernon-boulevard-bike-lanes-with-skepticism/#comment-53166 Glen - Personally I had no problem with the removal of parking on Vernon Blvd as we bike to Costco weekly to get groceries. As for trading green pace for parking Roosevelt Island already is losing too much green space to construction. - Eric Glen - Personally I had no problem with the removal of parking on Vernon Blvd as we bike to Costco weekly to get groceries. As for trading green pace for parking Roosevelt Island already is losing too much green space to construction. - Eric

]]> By: Queens Crapper http://www.streetsblog.org/2008/07/07/queens-cbs-greet-vernon-boulevard-bike-lanes-with-skepticism/comment-page-1/#comment-53165 Queens Crapper Tue, 08 Jul 2008 01:20:07 +0000 http://www.streetsblog.org/2008/07/07/queens-cbs-greet-vernon-boulevard-bike-lanes-with-skepticism/#comment-53165 "Industrial jobs actually have a lower commute by car rate than many other sectors." Show me the stats for this particular industrial area, where the public transportation sucks ass. "And the industrial areas along the East River have a bunch of free spaces along side streets even during weekdays." I suppose they won't now. It was great that the city gave people who park notice that this was going into effect. And it's not Roosevelt Islanders' fault that the bridge was built to Queens and not Manhattan. "Industrial jobs actually have a lower commute by car rate than many other sectors."

Show me the stats for this particular industrial area, where the public transportation sucks ass.

"And the industrial areas along the East River have a bunch of free spaces along side streets even during weekdays."

I suppose they won't now. It was great that the city gave people who park notice that this was going into effect. And it's not Roosevelt Islanders' fault that the bridge was built to Queens and not Manhattan.

]]> By: mfs http://www.streetsblog.org/2008/07/07/queens-cbs-greet-vernon-boulevard-bike-lanes-with-skepticism/comment-page-1/#comment-53164 mfs Mon, 07 Jul 2008 22:20:38 +0000 http://www.streetsblog.org/2008/07/07/queens-cbs-greet-vernon-boulevard-bike-lanes-with-skepticism/#comment-53164 Q Crapper- Industrial jobs actually have a lower commute by car rate than many other sectors. And the industrial areas along the East River have a bunch of free spaces along side streets even during weekdays. Q Crapper- Industrial jobs actually have a lower commute by car rate than many other sectors. And the industrial areas along the East River have a bunch of free spaces along side streets even during weekdays.

]]> By: Melissa http://www.streetsblog.org/2008/07/07/queens-cbs-greet-vernon-boulevard-bike-lanes-with-skepticism/comment-page-1/#comment-53163 Melissa Mon, 07 Jul 2008 21:33:32 +0000 http://www.streetsblog.org/2008/07/07/queens-cbs-greet-vernon-boulevard-bike-lanes-with-skepticism/#comment-53163 Queens (LIC, other than Vernon/Jackson Aves) also has an amazing amount of under-utilized sidewalk space. Biking up and down 23rd St every day, you have to fight with double parked trucks and other loading fiascos, while sidewalks 12' and wider remain predominantly unused (except of course by the auto mechanic shops who enjoy taking over as makeshift parking lots). I am surprised that the DOT isn't considering sidewalk-shared bike lanes in some areas to alleviate the parking loss arguments. Sidewalk lanes are common through much of Germany, and seem to work when there are low numbers of pedestrians on the sidewalks to begin with. Queens (LIC, other than Vernon/Jackson Aves) also has an amazing amount of under-utilized sidewalk space. Biking up and down 23rd St every day, you have to fight with double parked trucks and other loading fiascos, while sidewalks 12' and wider remain predominantly unused (except of course by the auto mechanic shops who enjoy taking over as makeshift parking lots). I am surprised that the DOT isn't considering sidewalk-shared bike lanes in some areas to alleviate the parking loss arguments. Sidewalk lanes are common through much of Germany, and seem to work when there are low numbers of pedestrians on the sidewalks to begin with.

]]> By: Stacy http://www.streetsblog.org/2008/07/07/queens-cbs-greet-vernon-boulevard-bike-lanes-with-skepticism/comment-page-1/#comment-53156 Stacy Mon, 07 Jul 2008 19:15:47 +0000 http://www.streetsblog.org/2008/07/07/queens-cbs-greet-vernon-boulevard-bike-lanes-with-skepticism/#comment-53156 If DOT had installed a protected bike lane, similar to the bike track on Ninth Avenue in Manhattan,it would have preserved some of the free on-street parking. Perhaps this would have been the best of both worlds. If DOT had installed a protected bike lane, similar to the bike track on Ninth Avenue in Manhattan,it would have preserved some of the free on-street parking. Perhaps this would have been the best of both worlds.

]]> By: fdr http://www.streetsblog.org/2008/07/07/queens-cbs-greet-vernon-boulevard-bike-lanes-with-skepticism/comment-page-1/#comment-53155 fdr Mon, 07 Jul 2008 19:11:32 +0000 http://www.streetsblog.org/2008/07/07/queens-cbs-greet-vernon-boulevard-bike-lanes-with-skepticism/#comment-53155 Sorry I pushed the wrong button. CB1 in Manhattan says DOT ignored them in creating a bike lane through City Hall Park that conflicts with pedestrians. "Less than a week after Community Board 1 overwhelmingly disapproved a bike path cutting through City Hall Park, the Department of Transportation put up signs directing cyclists to use the path." Quoting from the Downtown Express, I don't see the article on their web site. Sorry I pushed the wrong button.
CB1 in Manhattan says DOT ignored them in creating a bike lane through City Hall Park that conflicts with pedestrians. "Less than a week after Community Board 1 overwhelmingly disapproved a bike path cutting through City Hall Park, the Department of Transportation put up signs directing cyclists to use the path."
Quoting from the Downtown Express, I don't see the article on their web site.

]]> By: fdr http://www.streetsblog.org/2008/07/07/queens-cbs-greet-vernon-boulevard-bike-lanes-with-skepticism/comment-page-1/#comment-53154 fdr Mon, 07 Jul 2008 19:09:44 +0000 http://www.streetsblog.org/2008/07/07/queens-cbs-greet-vernon-boulevard-bike-lanes-with-skepticism/#comment-53154 CB1 in Manhattan says DOT ignored them in creating a bike lane through City Hall Park that conflicts with pedestrians. "Less than a week after Community Board CB1 in Manhattan says DOT ignored them in creating a bike lane through City Hall Park that conflicts with pedestrians. "Less than a week after Community Board

]]> By: Heffron http://www.streetsblog.org/2008/07/07/queens-cbs-greet-vernon-boulevard-bike-lanes-with-skepticism/comment-page-1/#comment-53144 Heffron Mon, 07 Jul 2008 18:39:35 +0000 http://www.streetsblog.org/2008/07/07/queens-cbs-greet-vernon-boulevard-bike-lanes-with-skepticism/#comment-53144 Is CB2K in Brooklyn then? Funny enough CB2Q hasn't had a transportation committee meeting since the chair died, which is why they met with the land use. I think community input for things is new ground for the DoT. They didn't do things like this so much before, and in fact I don't believe they have to even bother since a painted bike lane is not considered a large project requiring CB input. But then again the rules for CBs in general are vague and un-defined from district to district. A couple CB1 members I spoke to about the opposition letter claimed not to know what I was talking about. One even said that letters like this are issued on behalf of the whole CB1 all the time without running it past the rest of the board. Now I don't think if they had voted on the measure at CB1 they would have approved it to be honest, and the guys I was talking to need me to help with something else, so they could be bullshitting me to keep me on their side, but still, it's all very murky and confusing, particularly if you're not a regular attendee of these meetings. Is CB2K in Brooklyn then? Funny enough CB2Q hasn't had a transportation committee meeting since the chair died, which is why they met with the land use.

I think community input for things is new ground for the DoT. They didn't do things like this so much before, and in fact I don't believe they have to even bother since a painted bike lane is not considered a large project requiring CB input. But then again the rules for CBs in general are vague and un-defined from district to district. A couple CB1 members I spoke to about the opposition letter claimed not to know what I was talking about. One even said that letters like this are issued on behalf of the whole CB1 all the time without running it past the rest of the board. Now I don't think if they had voted on the measure at CB1 they would have approved it to be honest, and the guys I was talking to need me to help with something else, so they could be bullshitting me to keep me on their side, but still, it's all very murky and confusing, particularly if you're not a regular attendee of these meetings.

]]> By: Stacy http://www.streetsblog.org/2008/07/07/queens-cbs-greet-vernon-boulevard-bike-lanes-with-skepticism/comment-page-1/#comment-53143 Stacy Mon, 07 Jul 2008 18:32:17 +0000 http://www.streetsblog.org/2008/07/07/queens-cbs-greet-vernon-boulevard-bike-lanes-with-skepticism/#comment-53143 1 - Maybe if these RI residents want to live on a car-free island, and still own a car, they should expect to pay for a garage? 2- How can they call themselves Manhattan and still expect to have input with local Queens community decisions? 1 - Maybe if these RI residents want to live on a car-free island, and still own a car, they should expect to pay for a garage?

2- How can they call themselves Manhattan and still expect to have input with local Queens community decisions?

]]> By: Jeffrey Hymen http://www.streetsblog.org/2008/07/07/queens-cbs-greet-vernon-boulevard-bike-lanes-with-skepticism/comment-page-1/#comment-53142 Jeffrey Hymen Mon, 07 Jul 2008 18:24:45 +0000 http://www.streetsblog.org/2008/07/07/queens-cbs-greet-vernon-boulevard-bike-lanes-with-skepticism/#comment-53142 Can someone explain to me how CB1Q can have an opinion without the community board deliberating? Isn't the monthly meeting where an opinion would be determined through discussion and a vote? Also, a point of clarification: I was at the CB2K meeting at which there was a split vote on the Carlton-Cumberland bike lane. If I recall correctly, many people on the board voted against the bike lane because DOT by-passed the transportation committee. It was, for some, a comment on the process more than the bike lane itself. Can someone explain to me how CB1Q can have an opinion without the community board deliberating? Isn't the monthly meeting where an opinion would be determined through discussion and a vote?

Also, a point of clarification: I was at the CB2K meeting at which there was a split vote on the Carlton-Cumberland bike lane. If I recall correctly, many people on the board voted against the bike lane because DOT by-passed the transportation committee. It was, for some, a comment on the process more than the bike lane itself.

]]> By: Glenn http://www.streetsblog.org/2008/07/07/queens-cbs-greet-vernon-boulevard-bike-lanes-with-skepticism/comment-page-1/#comment-53129 Glenn Mon, 07 Jul 2008 17:11:08 +0000 http://www.streetsblog.org/2008/07/07/queens-cbs-greet-vernon-boulevard-bike-lanes-with-skepticism/#comment-53129 So Eric - Are you for installing more on street parking on Roosevelt Island to take care of the new demand for free onstreet parking? There's plenty of green space that would make for great surface parking lots ;) So Eric - Are you for installing more on street parking on Roosevelt Island to take care of the new demand for free onstreet parking? There's plenty of green space that would make for great surface parking lots ;)

]]> By: Roosevelt Island 360 (Eric) http://www.streetsblog.org/2008/07/07/queens-cbs-greet-vernon-boulevard-bike-lanes-with-skepticism/comment-page-1/#comment-53123 Roosevelt Island 360 (Eric) Mon, 07 Jul 2008 16:12:57 +0000 http://www.streetsblog.org/2008/07/07/queens-cbs-greet-vernon-boulevard-bike-lanes-with-skepticism/#comment-53123 Apparently Roosevelt Island residents (part of Manhattan's Community Board 8) were none too thrilled about the loss of parking as they were unaware of the changes even with my initially posting about it over a month ago. A number of RI residents parked on Vernon Blvd due to the fact that no on street free parking exists on RI. CB8M's Transportation Committee wanted to respond but were unsure how to politely ask that they be informed as members of their "community" were affected even thpugh they obviously have no decision making abilities or input into what happens in Queens. http://rooseveltisland360.blogspot.com/search?q=Parking+Vernon+Blvd. Apparently Roosevelt Island residents (part of Manhattan's Community Board 8) were none too thrilled about the loss of parking as they were unaware of the changes even with my initially posting about it over a month ago. A number of RI residents parked on Vernon Blvd due to the fact that no on street free parking exists on RI.

CB8M's Transportation Committee wanted to respond but were unsure how to politely ask that they be informed as members of their "community" were affected even thpugh they obviously have no decision making abilities or input into what happens in Queens.

http://rooseveltisland360.blogspot.com/search?q=Parking+Vernon+Blvd.

]]> By: Glenn http://www.streetsblog.org/2008/07/07/queens-cbs-greet-vernon-boulevard-bike-lanes-with-skepticism/comment-page-1/#comment-53121 Glenn Mon, 07 Jul 2008 15:37:29 +0000 http://www.streetsblog.org/2008/07/07/queens-cbs-greet-vernon-boulevard-bike-lanes-with-skepticism/#comment-53121 I've heard that much of the opposition to the bike lanes specifically the ones close to the Roosevelt Avenue Bridge are coming from RI residents that use it for free parking. Mind you RI has lots of great public space with community gardens, parks and a pedestrian only main street thanks to a large garage (with a monthly charge) that houses most of the cars but almost no free onstreet parking. I've heard that much of the opposition to the bike lanes specifically the ones close to the Roosevelt Avenue Bridge are coming from RI residents that use it for free parking. Mind you RI has lots of great public space with community gardens, parks and a pedestrian only main street thanks to a large garage (with a monthly charge) that houses most of the cars but almost no free onstreet parking.

]]> By: Heffron http://www.streetsblog.org/2008/07/07/queens-cbs-greet-vernon-boulevard-bike-lanes-with-skepticism/comment-page-1/#comment-53118 Heffron Mon, 07 Jul 2008 15:29:44 +0000 http://www.streetsblog.org/2008/07/07/queens-cbs-greet-vernon-boulevard-bike-lanes-with-skepticism/#comment-53118 Yeah some of the areas need some repaving. It's funny I had heard one DoT mucky-muck say they repave the roads when they lay down bike lanes, but I guess Vernon Blvd was too much for them? Maybe the DoT knows the next step is us needling away for a class 1 so why bother. The lanes look great though, and went in right after the Skillman bike lanes too. It's pretty exciting after years of only the 36th St lane to nowhere and the 20th Ave lane from the end of the Park to the trash dump on the way to Rikers to see some well thought out lanes go into place. Thanks for the great write up Streetsblog! Yeah some of the areas need some repaving. It's funny I had heard one DoT mucky-muck say they repave the roads when they lay down bike lanes, but I guess Vernon Blvd was too much for them? Maybe the DoT knows the next step is us needling away for a class 1 so why bother.

The lanes look great though, and went in right after the Skillman bike lanes too. It's pretty exciting after years of only the 36th St lane to nowhere and the 20th Ave lane from the end of the Park to the trash dump on the way to Rikers to see some well thought out lanes go into place. Thanks for the great write up Streetsblog!

]]> By: Bob http://www.streetsblog.org/2008/07/07/queens-cbs-greet-vernon-boulevard-bike-lanes-with-skepticism/comment-page-1/#comment-53117 Bob Mon, 07 Jul 2008 15:29:09 +0000 http://www.streetsblog.org/2008/07/07/queens-cbs-greet-vernon-boulevard-bike-lanes-with-skepticism/#comment-53117 "Sharrow", for "shared lane arrow", usually called "shared lane marking". "Sharrow", for "shared lane arrow", usually called "shared lane marking".

]]> By: Queens Crapper http://www.streetsblog.org/2008/07/07/queens-cbs-greet-vernon-boulevard-bike-lanes-with-skepticism/comment-page-1/#comment-53116 Queens Crapper Mon, 07 Jul 2008 15:28:11 +0000 http://www.streetsblog.org/2008/07/07/queens-cbs-greet-vernon-boulevard-bike-lanes-with-skepticism/#comment-53116 <i>"Most of the 200 spaces removed are in an industrial zone -- only 40 or 50 are used during the day."</i> Where does he think people who work in industrial zones park? What a genius. "Most of the 200 spaces removed are in an industrial zone -- only 40 or 50 are used during the day."

Where does he think people who work in industrial zones park? What a genius.

]]> By: mfs http://www.streetsblog.org/2008/07/07/queens-cbs-greet-vernon-boulevard-bike-lanes-with-skepticism/comment-page-1/#comment-53114 mfs Mon, 07 Jul 2008 14:50:08 +0000 http://www.streetsblog.org/2008/07/07/queens-cbs-greet-vernon-boulevard-bike-lanes-with-skepticism/#comment-53114 I've ridden this route several times and it is a big improvement on riding on Vernon alone. I'm really glad DOT did this. I do wonder about the placement of the bike sherrods (sp?) in the Hunterspoint area, though- they are directly in the door zone. Those in other places like Franklin Street in Brooklyn are out of it, which feels much safer and forces cars to actually share the lane with you. Also the shoulder on the southbound side is pretty degraded in some parts, which makes for a fairly bumpy ride. I've ridden this route several times and it is a big improvement on riding on Vernon alone. I'm really glad DOT did this.

I do wonder about the placement of the bike sherrods (sp?) in the Hunterspoint area, though- they are directly in the door zone. Those in other places like Franklin Street in Brooklyn are out of it, which feels much safer and forces cars to actually share the lane with you.

Also the shoulder on the southbound side is pretty degraded in some parts, which makes for a fairly bumpy ride.

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