Comments on: New Bike Lanes and Sharrows Lead to the Brooklyn Bridge http://www.streetsblog.org/2007/10/30/new-bike-lanes-and-sharrows-lead-to-the-brooklyn-bridge/ Covering the New York City Streets Renaissance Fri, 10 Feb 2012 16:07:00 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.3.1 By: Bill http://www.streetsblog.org/2007/10/30/new-bike-lanes-and-sharrows-lead-to-the-brooklyn-bridge/comment-page-1/#comment-39559 Bill Thu, 01 Nov 2007 22:22:22 +0000 http://www.streetsblog.org/2007/10/30/new-bike-lanes-and-sharrows-lead-to-the-brooklyn-bridge/#comment-39559 Here's an easier link: htttp://picasaweb.google.com/Bill.Orme Here’s an easier link:
htttp://picasaweb.google.com/Bill.Orme

]]> By: Steve http://www.streetsblog.org/2007/10/30/new-bike-lanes-and-sharrows-lead-to-the-brooklyn-bridge/comment-page-1/#comment-39545 Steve Thu, 01 Nov 2007 20:31:32 +0000 http://www.streetsblog.org/2007/10/30/new-bike-lanes-and-sharrows-lead-to-the-brooklyn-bridge/#comment-39545 Bill, I had a problem with the link; it wanted me to save a file. Can you check it out and re-send? Thanks. Bill,

I had a problem with the link; it wanted me to save a file. Can you check it out and re-send? Thanks.

]]> By: Bill Orme http://www.streetsblog.org/2007/10/30/new-bike-lanes-and-sharrows-lead-to-the-brooklyn-bridge/comment-page-1/#comment-39543 Bill Orme Thu, 01 Nov 2007 20:13:49 +0000 http://www.streetsblog.org/2007/10/30/new-bike-lanes-and-sharrows-lead-to-the-brooklyn-bridge/#comment-39543 http://picasaweb.google.com/data/feed/base/user/Bill.Orme?kind=album&alt=rss&hl=en_US For anyone wanting empirical proof, the above Picasa Public Gallery Link cointains an artless but pertinent collection of photos taken on random dates over the past year of the many varied official NYC vehicles blocking the Centre St. bike path between City Hall and the Brooklyn Bridge. Aside from forcing the hundreds of bike riders using this route every day into the hazardous two-lane street with city buses and two-way Bridge traffic,this egregious, flagrant appropriation of a public bike path for free all-day parking by City Hall and Board of Ed functionaries makes a mockery of the Bloomberg Administration's proclaimed commitments to 1) the promotion of biking as a safe urban transportation option and 2) ending of the notorious abuse of non-essentail parking privileges by city employees. http://picasaweb.google.com/data/feed/base/user/Bill.Orme?kind=album&alt=rss&hl=en_US

For anyone wanting empirical proof, the above Picasa Public Gallery Link cointains an artless but pertinent collection of photos taken on random dates over the past year of the many varied official NYC vehicles blocking the Centre St. bike path between City Hall and the Brooklyn Bridge. Aside from forcing the hundreds of bike riders using this route every day into the hazardous two-lane street with city buses and two-way Bridge traffic,this egregious, flagrant appropriation of a public bike path for free all-day parking by City Hall and Board of Ed functionaries makes a mockery of the Bloomberg Administration’s proclaimed commitments to 1) the promotion of biking as a safe urban transportation option and 2) ending of the notorious abuse of non-essentail parking privileges by city employees.

]]> By: Carl http://www.streetsblog.org/2007/10/30/new-bike-lanes-and-sharrows-lead-to-the-brooklyn-bridge/comment-page-1/#comment-39464 Carl Thu, 01 Nov 2007 13:57:55 +0000 http://www.streetsblog.org/2007/10/30/new-bike-lanes-and-sharrows-lead-to-the-brooklyn-bridge/#comment-39464 What's missing from the above comments in regards to the bike lane/buffer on Park Row adjacent to City Hall is how dangerous it actually is to approach the Brooklyn Bridge entrance from the south on a bike. When riding up one has to squeeze between oncoming traffic (largely comprised of city buses) and parked cars with an additional danger of pedestrians walking on to the street to cross. Every day when I ride from the financial district to the BK Bridge entrance I fear for my life while riding on that short stretch. What’s missing from the above comments in regards to the bike lane/buffer on Park Row adjacent to City Hall is how dangerous it actually is to approach the Brooklyn Bridge entrance from the south on a bike. When riding up one has to squeeze between oncoming traffic (largely comprised of city buses) and parked cars with an additional danger of pedestrians walking on to the street to cross. Every day when I ride from the financial district to the BK Bridge entrance I fear for my life while riding on that short stretch.

]]> By: Jonathan http://www.streetsblog.org/2007/10/30/new-bike-lanes-and-sharrows-lead-to-the-brooklyn-bridge/comment-page-1/#comment-39436 Jonathan Wed, 31 Oct 2007 20:08:19 +0000 http://www.streetsblog.org/2007/10/30/new-bike-lanes-and-sharrows-lead-to-the-brooklyn-bridge/#comment-39436 I just walked over the Brooklyn Bridge this afternoon and saw a scant 14 cyclists during my 10-minute stroll. Everyone was well behaved. On the roadway there was one Brooklyn-bound lane blocked off by DOT vehicles. Maybe on sunny weekend days the police can put up signs at the entrances to remind cyclists to go slowly and watch for pedestrians. That to me seems like a sensible, inexpensive way to help as many people as possible enjoy New York City's best tourist attraction. On the subject of the peak year for Brooklyn Bridge crossings, bear in mind that 1907 was the year before the first subway to Brooklyn opened. Since then, they've built five subway tunnels between Brooklyn and lower Manhattan, which, unlike the old Brooklyn Bridge streetcars, offer through connections to distant parts of NYC. I presume that the aggregate number of subway passengers on those five tunnels is at least three times the 1907 totals for Brooklyn Bridge crossings. I just walked over the Brooklyn Bridge this afternoon and saw a scant 14 cyclists during my 10-minute stroll. Everyone was well behaved. On the roadway there was one Brooklyn-bound lane blocked off by DOT vehicles.

Maybe on sunny weekend days the police can put up signs at the entrances to remind cyclists to go slowly and watch for pedestrians. That to me seems like a sensible, inexpensive way to help as many people as possible enjoy New York City’s best tourist attraction.

On the subject of the peak year for Brooklyn Bridge crossings, bear in mind that 1907 was the year before the first subway to Brooklyn opened. Since then, they’ve built five subway tunnels between Brooklyn and lower Manhattan, which, unlike the old Brooklyn Bridge streetcars, offer through connections to distant parts of NYC. I presume that the aggregate number of subway passengers on those five tunnels is at least three times the 1907 totals for Brooklyn Bridge crossings.

]]> By: a.v. http://www.streetsblog.org/2007/10/30/new-bike-lanes-and-sharrows-lead-to-the-brooklyn-bridge/comment-page-1/#comment-39424 a.v. Wed, 31 Oct 2007 16:31:35 +0000 http://www.streetsblog.org/2007/10/30/new-bike-lanes-and-sharrows-lead-to-the-brooklyn-bridge/#comment-39424 I both ride and drive over the Brooklyn bridge frequently and think it's quite workable for everyone as is. I have not seen cops blocking traffic lanes in recent months as they did regularly a few years ago. I find that 98 percent of the pedestrians stay to their side, and as long as bikers who use the path are reasonable courteous, everyone keeps moving even during nice evenings. It's a busy urban pathway -- if everyone shares then everyone can enjoy. BTW, I hear construction on the approach ramps will begin soon. I suspect that will slow things down for the vehicles for several years. I both ride and drive over the Brooklyn bridge frequently and think it’s quite workable for everyone as is. I have not seen cops blocking traffic lanes in recent months as they did regularly a few years ago. I find that 98 percent of the pedestrians stay to their side, and as long as bikers who use the path are reasonable courteous, everyone keeps moving even during nice evenings. It’s a busy urban pathway — if everyone shares then everyone can enjoy.

BTW, I hear construction on the approach ramps will begin soon. I suspect that will slow things down for the vehicles for several years.

]]> By: Hilary http://www.streetsblog.org/2007/10/30/new-bike-lanes-and-sharrows-lead-to-the-brooklyn-bridge/comment-page-1/#comment-39421 Hilary Wed, 31 Oct 2007 15:34:36 +0000 http://www.streetsblog.org/2007/10/30/new-bike-lanes-and-sharrows-lead-to-the-brooklyn-bridge/#comment-39421 Both the Manhattan and Brooklyn Bridge are major crossings that must be made to accommodate pedestrians, bicycles and vehicles. If the congestion of pedestrians and bicycles are causing conflicts (and impeding moblility) on the Brooklyn Bridge, and there is evidently spare capacity for vehicles, it is time to look at shifting a lane. Optimizing mobility is key. Are there figures for the number of people occupying the bridge vs. those in vehicles at a given time? Both the Manhattan and Brooklyn Bridge are major crossings that must be made to accommodate pedestrians, bicycles and vehicles. If the congestion of pedestrians and bicycles are causing conflicts (and impeding moblility) on the Brooklyn Bridge, and there is evidently spare capacity for vehicles, it is time to look at shifting a lane. Optimizing mobility is key. Are there figures for the number of people occupying the bridge vs. those in vehicles at a given time?

]]> By: flp http://www.streetsblog.org/2007/10/30/new-bike-lanes-and-sharrows-lead-to-the-brooklyn-bridge/comment-page-1/#comment-39418 flp Wed, 31 Oct 2007 15:22:19 +0000 http://www.streetsblog.org/2007/10/30/new-bike-lanes-and-sharrows-lead-to-the-brooklyn-bridge/#comment-39418 as far as bridge crossings are concerned, my experience suggests that it would be helpful to have far more signage (on ground painted or otherwise) to remind folks who belongs where. i really think this would help especially on the BB as the one time visitors are pretty damn clueless! of course, cyclists crossing the BB should expect a less than smooth crossing. if ya wanna whiz... take manhattan! as far as bridge crossings are concerned, my experience suggests that it would be helpful to have far more signage (on ground painted or otherwise) to remind folks who belongs where. i really think this would help especially on the BB as the one time visitors are pretty damn clueless! of course, cyclists crossing the BB should expect a less than smooth crossing. if ya wanna whiz… take manhattan!

]]> By: anon http://www.streetsblog.org/2007/10/30/new-bike-lanes-and-sharrows-lead-to-the-brooklyn-bridge/comment-page-1/#comment-39417 anon Wed, 31 Oct 2007 15:21:30 +0000 http://www.streetsblog.org/2007/10/30/new-bike-lanes-and-sharrows-lead-to-the-brooklyn-bridge/#comment-39417 Jonathan -- I can confirm what Hillary says, the cops have regularly taken it down to two lanes in the Brooklyn bound direction. Not so sure how much they have done it recently, but it was a near nightly occurence a couple of years ago. That being said, I don't think closing a lane is a workable alternative. As bob bob points out, the Manhattan bridge is really a much better alternative, as it is a lot less crowded and, even if pedestrians end up on the north side, they typically aren't taking pictures, gawking, etc. so are easier to navigate aroound Jonathan — I can confirm what Hillary says, the cops have regularly taken it down to two lanes in the Brooklyn bound direction. Not so sure how much they have done it recently, but it was a near nightly occurence a couple of years ago. That being said, I don’t think closing a lane is a workable alternative.

As bob bob points out, the Manhattan bridge is really a much better alternative, as it is a lot less crowded and, even if pedestrians end up on the north side, they typically aren’t taking pictures, gawking, etc. so are easier to navigate aroound

]]> By: bob bob http://www.streetsblog.org/2007/10/30/new-bike-lanes-and-sharrows-lead-to-the-brooklyn-bridge/comment-page-1/#comment-39407 bob bob Wed, 31 Oct 2007 14:09:03 +0000 http://www.streetsblog.org/2007/10/30/new-bike-lanes-and-sharrows-lead-to-the-brooklyn-bridge/#comment-39407 i'm seeing many good points about separating the bike lane and the pedestrian walkway. but i am still very skeptical that it will help. i frequently use the manhattan bridge, and both, pedestrians and bikers, seem to have problem respecting each others designated lanes (bikes- north side, pedestrians-south). i don't know if it's because of them not knowing which one they belong on, or do they just ignore it because it's closer and more convenient for them. either way i use the manhattan bridge as both pedestrian and a biker, both into and out of manhattan, and i would love if people could respect each other's space. we need to work together, and not get in each others way especially where there is a great infrastructure provided for us. i’m seeing many good points about separating the bike lane and the pedestrian walkway. but i am still very skeptical that it will help. i frequently use the manhattan bridge, and both, pedestrians and bikers, seem to have problem respecting each others designated lanes (bikes- north side, pedestrians-south). i don’t know if it’s because of them not knowing which one they belong on, or do they just ignore it because it’s closer and more convenient for them.
either way i use the manhattan bridge as both pedestrian and a biker, both into and out of manhattan, and i would love if people could respect each other’s space.
we need to work together, and not get in each others way especially where there is a great infrastructure provided for us.

]]> By: Dave H. http://www.streetsblog.org/2007/10/30/new-bike-lanes-and-sharrows-lead-to-the-brooklyn-bridge/comment-page-1/#comment-39399 Dave H. Wed, 31 Oct 2007 03:30:27 +0000 http://www.streetsblog.org/2007/10/30/new-bike-lanes-and-sharrows-lead-to-the-brooklyn-bridge/#comment-39399 Does anyone have a study other than the 2004 SF study about the value of sharrows (i.e. effects on motorist and cyclist behavior)? Our local DOT-equivalent is claiming SF is too far away and "culturally different" for the data to be relevant. I am hoping someone can point me to one conducted in NY (but anywhere is fine). Does anyone have a study other than the 2004 SF study about the value of sharrows (i.e. effects on motorist and cyclist behavior)? Our local DOT-equivalent is claiming SF is too far away and “culturally different” for the data to be relevant. I am hoping someone can point me to one conducted in NY (but anywhere is fine).

]]> By: Jonathan http://www.streetsblog.org/2007/10/30/new-bike-lanes-and-sharrows-lead-to-the-brooklyn-bridge/comment-page-1/#comment-39395 Jonathan Wed, 31 Oct 2007 01:48:48 +0000 http://www.streetsblog.org/2007/10/30/new-bike-lanes-and-sharrows-lead-to-the-brooklyn-bridge/#comment-39395 Hilary, Funny! I have driven across the bridge fairly frequently since 2001, both during rush hours and at off-peak times, and I've never seen the cops blocking an entire lane of traffic and forcing the three lanes in either direction to merge down to two. But I'll take your word for it as perhaps your comments will discourage other people from driving that route. Hilary, Funny! I have driven across the bridge fairly frequently since 2001, both during rush hours and at off-peak times, and I’ve never seen the cops blocking an entire lane of traffic and forcing the three lanes in either direction to merge down to two. But I’ll take your word for it as perhaps your comments will discourage other people from driving that route.

]]> By: Hilary http://www.streetsblog.org/2007/10/30/new-bike-lanes-and-sharrows-lead-to-the-brooklyn-bridge/comment-page-1/#comment-39393 Hilary Wed, 31 Oct 2007 01:33:00 +0000 http://www.streetsblog.org/2007/10/30/new-bike-lanes-and-sharrows-lead-to-the-brooklyn-bridge/#comment-39393 Jonathan - I'm quite sure that the police are often parked on the bridge, forcing a merge from 3 to two lanes. Jonathan – I’m quite sure that the police are often parked on the bridge, forcing a merge from 3 to two lanes.

]]> By: mork http://www.streetsblog.org/2007/10/30/new-bike-lanes-and-sharrows-lead-to-the-brooklyn-bridge/comment-page-1/#comment-39392 mork Wed, 31 Oct 2007 00:57:41 +0000 http://www.streetsblog.org/2007/10/30/new-bike-lanes-and-sharrows-lead-to-the-brooklyn-bridge/#comment-39392 Hey people. If you're riding on the BB, you just have to go slow and be mindful of others. If you expect to go up there in the evening rush hour and expect to go all gangbusters, well, then you're just being a jerk. Also, re: landmark status. Why don't they return it to its original streetcar-laden layout? That would be the most historically correct, and it would increase the capacity. (The peak year for Brooklyn Bridge crossings was 1907! See http://www.fhwa.dot.gov/preservation/tspfig5.cfm ) Hey people. If you’re riding on the BB, you just have to go slow and be mindful of others. If you expect to go up there in the evening rush hour and expect to go all gangbusters, well, then you’re just being a jerk.

Also, re: landmark status. Why don’t they return it to its original streetcar-laden layout? That would be the most historically correct, and it would increase the capacity.

(The peak year for Brooklyn Bridge crossings was 1907! See http://www.fhwa.dot.gov/preservation/tspfig5.cfm )

]]> By: Jonathan http://www.streetsblog.org/2007/10/30/new-bike-lanes-and-sharrows-lead-to-the-brooklyn-bridge/comment-page-1/#comment-39390 Jonathan Wed, 31 Oct 2007 00:20:57 +0000 http://www.streetsblog.org/2007/10/30/new-bike-lanes-and-sharrows-lead-to-the-brooklyn-bridge/#comment-39390 Hilary, there are still three full traffic lanes in either direction on the Brooklyn Bridge. I doubt I'm revealing any grand homeland-security secrets by pointing out that the police usually park in the median between the Centre St entrance and the merging loop on the Brooklyn-bound side, and off to the right on the Manhattan-bound side. Yours is, however, a pretty good argument, I believe, for making a bike lane on the Verrazano, where continual construction takes one lower-level lane out of service (right now it's on the Brooklyn-bound side). When construction is finished, one lane could be dedicated to HPV traffic during off-hours, with a shuttle bus during rush hours, like they used to do on the Queensboro Bridge. I would definitely like to see that as a trial program. Hilary, there are still three full traffic lanes in either direction on the Brooklyn Bridge. I doubt I’m revealing any grand homeland-security secrets by pointing out that the police usually park in the median between the Centre St entrance and the merging loop on the Brooklyn-bound side, and off to the right on the Manhattan-bound side.

Yours is, however, a pretty good argument, I believe, for making a bike lane on the Verrazano, where continual construction takes one lower-level lane out of service (right now it’s on the Brooklyn-bound side). When construction is finished, one lane could be dedicated to HPV traffic during off-hours, with a shuttle bus during rush hours, like they used to do on the Queensboro Bridge. I would definitely like to see that as a trial program.

]]> By: blap http://www.streetsblog.org/2007/10/30/new-bike-lanes-and-sharrows-lead-to-the-brooklyn-bridge/comment-page-1/#comment-39388 blap Tue, 30 Oct 2007 22:30:27 +0000 http://www.streetsblog.org/2007/10/30/new-bike-lanes-and-sharrows-lead-to-the-brooklyn-bridge/#comment-39388 hey that is a great slogan.... "one less lane" or "one less lane... for cars" hey that is a great slogan….

“one less lane”

or

“one less lane… for cars”

]]> By: Hilary http://www.streetsblog.org/2007/10/30/new-bike-lanes-and-sharrows-lead-to-the-brooklyn-bridge/comment-page-1/#comment-39387 Hilary Tue, 30 Oct 2007 21:43:53 +0000 http://www.streetsblog.org/2007/10/30/new-bike-lanes-and-sharrows-lead-to-the-brooklyn-bridge/#comment-39387 Since 9/11 they have effectively eliminated a lane on the bridge by positioning a police car on the Brooklyn Bridge. That's a pretty long pilot to see if we could live with one less lane! Why not turn it over to bikes, and let the pedestrians have their own? Since 9/11 they have effectively eliminated a lane on the bridge by positioning a police car on the Brooklyn Bridge. That’s a pretty long pilot to see if we could live with one less lane! Why not turn it over to bikes, and let the pedestrians have their own?

]]> By: Nick Grossman http://www.streetsblog.org/2007/10/30/new-bike-lanes-and-sharrows-lead-to-the-brooklyn-bridge/comment-page-1/#comment-39386 Nick Grossman Tue, 30 Oct 2007 21:38:08 +0000 http://www.streetsblog.org/2007/10/30/new-bike-lanes-and-sharrows-lead-to-the-brooklyn-bridge/#comment-39386 I agree with Ace (#1) that the bike/ped situation on the B Bridge isn't good. I was one of those bikers riding over the bridge on Sunday -- it was really crowded, and I spent most of the time worrying that I was going to hit a wayward tourist. I love riding over the bridge, but every time I do I'm amazed that I didn't kill anyone. You can't blame people for not realizing they're straying over the line, or for being terrified when a bike whizzes by. I agree with Ace (#1) that the bike/ped situation on the B Bridge isn’t good. I was one of those bikers riding over the bridge on Sunday — it was really crowded, and I spent most of the time worrying that I was going to hit a wayward tourist.

I love riding over the bridge, but every time I do I’m amazed that I didn’t kill anyone. You can’t blame people for not realizing they’re straying over the line, or for being terrified when a bike whizzes by.

]]> By: mf http://www.streetsblog.org/2007/10/30/new-bike-lanes-and-sharrows-lead-to-the-brooklyn-bridge/comment-page-1/#comment-39383 mf Tue, 30 Oct 2007 20:54:40 +0000 http://www.streetsblog.org/2007/10/30/new-bike-lanes-and-sharrows-lead-to-the-brooklyn-bridge/#comment-39383 They really should have posted 15 mph speed limits for cars where they have the Sharrows. As it is now, the merge is pretty dangerous. They really should have posted 15 mph speed limits for cars where they have the Sharrows. As it is now, the merge is pretty dangerous.

]]> By: rlb http://www.streetsblog.org/2007/10/30/new-bike-lanes-and-sharrows-lead-to-the-brooklyn-bridge/comment-page-1/#comment-39382 rlb Tue, 30 Oct 2007 20:51:03 +0000 http://www.streetsblog.org/2007/10/30/new-bike-lanes-and-sharrows-lead-to-the-brooklyn-bridge/#comment-39382 (the decking would run afoul of the bridge's landmark status) Depending on the time of day and the direction of greater traffic, maybe they could make either a Manhattan or Brooklyn bound lane a two way bike lane? (the decking would run afoul of the bridge’s landmark status)

Depending on the time of day and the direction of greater traffic, maybe they could make either a Manhattan or Brooklyn bound lane a two way bike lane?

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