In other words, DOT seems to be afraid that if they reduce "throughput" in this part of Brooklyn, they'll come under much more criticism than they would for making Sixth and Seventh Avenues one-way. Are these critics only in the minds of the DOT engineers, or do they exist? Are they really that powerful, or can they be overcome?

For comparison, I'm thinking of the motorists from Flatbush, Midwood etc. who have been able to preserve car access to Prospect Park even though people around the park have said they want cars out in petition after petition.

Are there similar people in Bay Ridge and Bensonhurst who will jump down the DOT's throat if they get slowed down on Fourth Avenue? Can the specific political forces be identified?

How does that plan jibe with these newly announced changes? Perhaps DOT is proposing the changes on Sixth Avenue to compensate for the earlier changes on Fourth Avenue? Making Sixth Avenue one way will draw vehicles off Fourth Avenue, thereby alleviating the congestion caused by the Pacific diversion.

Question is what will happen to Sixth Avenue on the other side of Flatbush? As I remember, it is currently a one way street going in the opposite direction of what's proposed for Sixth.

Do people expect DOT to change the direction of that stretch as well? That way buses and cars can come barreling down Sixth right into Ratner's parking garages and loading docks. It sounds like a way to accomodate delivery trucks and buses going to AY without having them go through the intersection of Atlantic and Flatbush.

"DOT wants every vehicle traveling on 7th Avenue to travel At the speed limit".

Ignore the narrowed lanes herring, the one-way-roadway drivers won't care one bit, the real issue is "travel within the. . .limit"="travel AT the. . .limit".

Obviously now, traffic on 7th almost never moves at the City Speed Limit during NY's extended work-a-day hours, but if DOT does create a one-way through-route then the DOT will have 7th Ave transiting many multiples of the current vehicle count during the hours just ahead of and after the traffic-jam period(s) each day and they "win".

Court Street & western Atlantic Avenue provide excruiciating examples of just how many cars DOT can shove through a pedi-resi neighborhood in those roughtimes aound/during NYC's rush-hours when the pitiful local highways are parked with seething traffic.

The real problem is that NYC's public ways are controlled by an agency beholden to only one interest group (the internal-cumbustion engine rah-rah crowd). Plainly, if DOT can Provide client Drivers with a 1/2 mile to 3/4 mile stretch of movement w/o interruption then DOT has pleasantly surprised their clients... where if, for example, the Parks Dept 'owned' the public ways and leased area for pavement and vehicle traffic to the DOT then the citizenry might have a slim chance of having the numerous other uses for a public way properly addressed and the DOT might actually have to explain why over 100,000+ people (kids, teens, pensioners, parents, exercisers, sports-folk) have to cross, excuse me, ALL 100,000+ immediate neighbors of Prospect Park have to cross riduculously high-speed roadways to get to this borough's one "accesible" large park .

o, So little time to lambast the Fisher-Price-ization of the minds of our civil engineers...

-james

One way streets are a recipe for disaster. There's *plenty of evidence* to show that one-way streets encourage faster traffic, the last thing you want on 6th/7th Avenues.

Just compare the ambiance of 6th/7th with, for example, Court/Smith streets and you will see the difference. Or even 8th Av/PPW (these should be 2-way streets as well.)

Vehicles on the latter streets definitely move faster, and cyles and pedestrians are more at risk there. I would not even risk cycling on 8th Av, but 6/7 are fine.

The changes to 4th Av, are, however, welcome.

Please do all you can to oppose this.

"DOT also proposes making these changes in conjunction with a plan that would remove a travel lane in each direction on 4th Avenue (between 17th and Dean Streets) using this space to improve the existing left turn bays."

Here's my interpretation:

1. DOT decided that Fourth Avenue really needs better left turn bays, but they can't think of a way to do it without taking a lane in each direction.

2. DOT thinks that taking a lane would make it easier for cars and probably cause less crashes, but they're concerned that it might even decrease the vehicle throughput.

3. God forbid DOT should decrease throughput! These cars have to go somewhere, so why not through the shopping and population centers of Park Slope?

After all, the only other benefits they claim for this are to make Sixth and Seventh Avenues more pedestrian friendly, and there are plenty of other ways of doing that.

Does this sound plausible, or am I off-base?

As Walter Kulash says, it is like dealing with obesity by letting your belt out.

But I don't think that they are talking about left-turn lanes here. When they talk about one-way streets simplifying turning movements, I think they mean that you can turn left without any traffic in the opposite direction to block you.

Of course, this actually speeds up traffic, lets people make turns without slowing down for traffic in the opposite direction - and so it endangers pedestrians.

They are going in everywhere at the expense of peds and cyclists.

There are two instances on 5th Ave in Park Slope where the bike lane is not striped because DOT needed room to put in turning lanes. There is one example at intersecton of 5th Ave/9th Street.

we can all agree that the changes proposed for 4th ave are good, nothing there to complain about (unless you are a motorist concerned about worse traffic I guess). will advocates fall for the gift of 4th ave?

From this line, it seems like the problem they're trying to address is speeding on 7th Avenue, or perhaps they're just trying to throw "us" a bone.

Seems silly to presume that turning 7th Ave one-way would slow traffic.

PARK SLOPE TO DOT:

WE DON'T WANT YOUR "SOLUTIONS". TELL US WHAT THE PROBLEM IS AND LET US SOLVE IT!!!