Comments on: A Brief History of New York City Congestion Charging http://www.streetsblog.org/2006/12/04/a-brief-history-of-new-york-city-congestion-charging/ Covering the New York City Streets Renaissance Fri, 10 Feb 2012 16:07:00 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.3.1 By: David Chesler http://www.streetsblog.org/2006/12/04/a-brief-history-of-new-york-city-congestion-charging/comment-page-1/#comment-14892 David Chesler Tue, 05 Dec 2006 15:22:32 +0000 http://www.streetsblog.org/2006/12/04/a-brief-history-of-new-york-city-congestion-charging/#comment-14892 I admit I'm out of the loop. What speed are the avenue lights synchronized for now? (Not that it stops people, but there's no point in speeding faster than the synchronized speed once you're near the front.) I admit I’m out of the loop. What speed are the avenue lights synchronized for now? (Not that it stops people, but there’s no point in speeding faster than the synchronized speed once you’re near the front.)

]]> By: Nicolo Macchiavelli http://www.streetsblog.org/2006/12/04/a-brief-history-of-new-york-city-congestion-charging/comment-page-1/#comment-14736 Nicolo Macchiavelli Tue, 05 Dec 2006 04:27:17 +0000 http://www.streetsblog.org/2006/12/04/a-brief-history-of-new-york-city-congestion-charging/#comment-14736 The Garage owners are affected by increasing land rents (R.E. Prices). Their property will become proportionally more valuable and they will be displaced. Restaurants will actually make more money because less of it will go to time spent driving to the resaurant. But you cant tell them that until after you set up the system. Until then they will hire Sam Schwartz, or anyone else with some cred, to kill the system. The Garage owners are affected by increasing land rents (R.E. Prices). Their property will become proportionally more valuable and they will be displaced. Restaurants will actually make more money because less of it will go to time spent driving to the resaurant. But you cant tell them that until after you set up the system. Until then they will hire Sam Schwartz, or anyone else with some cred, to kill the system.

]]> By: ddartley http://www.streetsblog.org/2006/12/04/a-brief-history-of-new-york-city-congestion-charging/comment-page-1/#comment-14725 ddartley Tue, 05 Dec 2006 02:52:43 +0000 http://www.streetsblog.org/2006/12/04/a-brief-history-of-new-york-city-congestion-charging/#comment-14725 David, I know the 22% was not in speed *limit.* We all know that currently, when there is any stretch of Avenue even slightly clear of traffic, motorists hit 40 mph and up all the time. I'm just worried about that being a dangerous side effect of something otherwise good. I'm concerned that if congestion pricing does happen, there will be political backlash against "the anti-car nuts," and SAFETY improvements such as reducing speed limits (which in my opinion should be #1), will not be happen. Any congestion pricing scheme that takes effect had better look like what Aaron's #6 response describes, or else, I fear, it will damage safety while it improves health. David, I know the 22% was not in speed *limit.*

We all know that currently, when there is any stretch of Avenue even slightly clear of traffic, motorists hit 40 mph and up all the time. I’m just worried about that being a dangerous side effect of something otherwise good.

I’m concerned that if congestion pricing does happen, there will be political backlash against “the anti-car nuts,” and SAFETY improvements such as reducing speed limits (which in my opinion should be #1), will not be happen.

Any congestion pricing scheme that takes effect had better look like what Aaron’s #6 response describes, or else, I fear, it will damage safety while it improves health.

]]> By: David Chesler http://www.streetsblog.org/2006/12/04/a-brief-history-of-new-york-city-congestion-charging/comment-page-1/#comment-14689 David Chesler Mon, 04 Dec 2006 22:23:07 +0000 http://www.streetsblog.org/2006/12/04/a-brief-history-of-new-york-city-congestion-charging/#comment-14689 A 22% increase in speed does not mean the speed _limit_ would go from 30mph to 35mph; it means that much less time spent in the kind of traffic where it would be faster to walk. A 22% increase in speed does not mean the speed _limit_ would go from 30mph to 35mph; it means that much less time spent in the kind of traffic where it would be faster to walk.

]]> By: Mike http://www.streetsblog.org/2006/12/04/a-brief-history-of-new-york-city-congestion-charging/comment-page-1/#comment-14659 Mike Mon, 04 Dec 2006 20:41:36 +0000 http://www.streetsblog.org/2006/12/04/a-brief-history-of-new-york-city-congestion-charging/#comment-14659 I wonder how much garage owners would suffer, given that a congestion charge would eliminate mainly the people who couldn't afford parking to begin with. Moreso for restaurants. I would imagine their are plenty of big spenders who wouldn't drive into town for dinner because the streets and bridges are clogged with night-shift doorman, hospital workers, cops, etc. I wonder how much garage owners would suffer, given that a congestion charge would eliminate mainly the people who couldn’t afford parking to begin with.

Moreso for restaurants. I would imagine their are plenty of big spenders who wouldn’t drive into town for dinner because the streets and bridges are clogged with night-shift doorman, hospital workers, cops, etc.

]]> By: Nicolo Machiavelli http://www.streetsblog.org/2006/12/04/a-brief-history-of-new-york-city-congestion-charging/comment-page-1/#comment-14654 Nicolo Machiavelli Mon, 04 Dec 2006 19:54:37 +0000 http://www.streetsblog.org/2006/12/04/a-brief-history-of-new-york-city-congestion-charging/#comment-14654 Watch out Bro., that Garage group and the Restraunteurs were the ones who paid Sam Schwartz to massacre the decongesting traffic control systems in place after 911. Schwartz has a lot of cred but knows how to cash a check. Watch out Bro., that Garage group and the Restraunteurs were the ones who paid Sam Schwartz to massacre the decongesting traffic control systems in place after 911. Schwartz has a lot of cred but knows how to cash a check.

]]> By: Glenn http://www.streetsblog.org/2006/12/04/a-brief-history-of-new-york-city-congestion-charging/comment-page-1/#comment-14633 Glenn Mon, 04 Dec 2006 17:29:13 +0000 http://www.streetsblog.org/2006/12/04/a-brief-history-of-new-york-city-congestion-charging/#comment-14633 Am I missing something - is it only the timeline that got published? Am I missing something – is it only the timeline that got published?

]]> By: ddartley http://www.streetsblog.org/2006/12/04/a-brief-history-of-new-york-city-congestion-charging/comment-page-1/#comment-14628 ddartley Mon, 04 Dec 2006 16:56:55 +0000 http://www.streetsblog.org/2006/12/04/a-brief-history-of-new-york-city-congestion-charging/#comment-14628 Aaron, I would not be on the fence if I were confident that the vision you describe would be fully realized. But I am very skeptical about government getting new, exciting, positive initiatives right or complete. (Just look at the "keep out of the way-rrows.") Still, these are hopeful times. Aaron, I would not be on the fence if I were confident that the vision you describe would be fully realized. But I am very skeptical about government getting new, exciting, positive initiatives right or complete.

(Just look at the “keep out of the way-rrows.”)

Still, these are hopeful times.

]]> By: Aaron http://www.streetsblog.org/2006/12/04/a-brief-history-of-new-york-city-congestion-charging/comment-page-1/#comment-14626 Aaron Mon, 04 Dec 2006 16:50:15 +0000 http://www.streetsblog.org/2006/12/04/a-brief-history-of-new-york-city-congestion-charging/#comment-14626 Dartley: If a congestion charging program is done correctly then the reduction in motor vehicles will be matched by a tightening of street space allocated to motor vehicles. The newly freed up street space will be given over to buses, bikes and peds. You're not going to see cars screaming through Midtown Manhattan on wide, empty streets. Dartley: If a congestion charging program is done correctly then the reduction in motor vehicles will be matched by a tightening of street space allocated to motor vehicles. The newly freed up street space will be given over to buses, bikes and peds. You’re not going to see cars screaming through Midtown Manhattan on wide, empty streets.

]]> By: Steve http://www.streetsblog.org/2006/12/04/a-brief-history-of-new-york-city-congestion-charging/comment-page-1/#comment-14625 Steve Mon, 04 Dec 2006 16:48:28 +0000 http://www.streetsblog.org/2006/12/04/a-brief-history-of-new-york-city-congestion-charging/#comment-14625 I agree on 30 MPH being too high--especially since there is always the free "+10" that virtually every driver takes. You could also consider a differential limit depending upon street width, mix of anticipated street users, arterial role of roadway, other factors. Residential cross-streets should be 15 MPH in my view, to hold drivers down to 25 MPH. I agree on 30 MPH being too high–especially since there is always the free “+10″ that virtually every driver takes. You could also consider a differential limit depending upon street width, mix of anticipated street users, arterial role of roadway, other factors. Residential cross-streets should be 15 MPH in my view, to hold drivers down to 25 MPH.

]]> By: ddartley http://www.streetsblog.org/2006/12/04/a-brief-history-of-new-york-city-congestion-charging/comment-page-1/#comment-14624 ddartley Mon, 04 Dec 2006 16:44:42 +0000 http://www.streetsblog.org/2006/12/04/a-brief-history-of-new-york-city-congestion-charging/#comment-14624 One concern I have: In 1975 Singapore such a program resulted in 22% increase in traffic speed? I am really on the fence about congestion pricing in NYC, largely for that reason. Whether or not it comes to pass, I think substantial, universal traffic calming would be a bigger boon to public health and safety. There was a brief discussion of NYC speed limits in a recent thread. As a former driver, and now a NYC pedestrian/cyclist, I see no reason for speed limits to be as high at 30 mph on city streets. One concern I have:

In 1975 Singapore such a program resulted in 22% increase in traffic speed?

I am really on the fence about congestion pricing in NYC, largely for that reason.

Whether or not it comes to pass, I think substantial, universal traffic calming would be a bigger boon to public health and safety.

There was a brief discussion of NYC speed limits in a recent thread. As a former driver, and now a NYC pedestrian/cyclist, I see no reason for speed limits to be as high at 30 mph on city streets.

]]> By: Aaron http://www.streetsblog.org/2006/12/04/a-brief-history-of-new-york-city-congestion-charging/comment-page-1/#comment-14585 Aaron Mon, 04 Dec 2006 15:43:41 +0000 http://www.streetsblog.org/2006/12/04/a-brief-history-of-new-york-city-congestion-charging/#comment-14585 He couldn't be related to me. The last name is spelled differently. Can you believe it? I spent hours working with the fact-checkers over there and that's how my byline turned out. Oh, well. He couldn’t be related to me. The last name is spelled differently.

Can you believe it? I spent hours working with the fact-checkers over there and that’s how my byline turned out. Oh, well.

]]> By: Mitch http://www.streetsblog.org/2006/12/04/a-brief-history-of-new-york-city-congestion-charging/comment-page-1/#comment-14584 Mitch Mon, 04 Dec 2006 15:42:08 +0000 http://www.streetsblog.org/2006/12/04/a-brief-history-of-new-york-city-congestion-charging/#comment-14584 The first time I looked at this item, I read the group's name as "the Committee to Keep New York City Congestion Tax-Free." The first time I looked at this item, I read the group’s name as “the Committee to Keep New York City Congestion Tax-Free.”

]]> By: Glenn http://www.streetsblog.org/2006/12/04/a-brief-history-of-new-york-city-congestion-charging/comment-page-1/#comment-14581 Glenn Mon, 04 Dec 2006 15:37:57 +0000 http://www.streetsblog.org/2006/12/04/a-brief-history-of-new-york-city-congestion-charging/#comment-14581 Who's Nick Naperstek? Who’s Nick Naperstek?

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